Talk:Tamil phonology

This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the Tamil phonology article.
This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject.

Put new text under old text. Click here to start a new topic.
New to Wikipedia? Welcome! Learn to edit; get help.

Article policies

Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL

India: Tamil Nadu Low‑importance

	India portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject India, which aims to improve Wikipedia's coverage of India-related topics. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page.IndiaWikipedia:WikiProject IndiaTemplate:WikiProject IndiaIndia articles
Low	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.
	This article is supported by WikiProject Tamil Nadu (assessed as High-importance).
	This article was last assessed in March 2012.

Languages

	Language portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Languages, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of languages on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.LanguagesWikipedia:WikiProject LanguagesTemplate:WikiProject Languageslanguage articles
???	This article has not yet received a rating on the project's importance scale.

Linguistics: Phonetics Low‑importance

	Linguistics portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Linguistics, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of linguistics on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.LinguisticsWikipedia:WikiProject LinguisticsTemplate:WikiProject LinguisticsLinguistics articles
Low	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.
	This article is supported by Phonetics Task Force.

NASAL VOWELS[edit]

Modern spoken Tamil has nasal vowels. These should be mentioned in this review. Source: http://books.google.es/books?id=Oqe-QsaZnnQC&pg=PA18&dq=tamil+%22nasal+vowels%22&hl=es&ei=MTluTJiyBY6Z4AauiMGtCw&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=2&ved=0CC8Q6AEwAQ#v=onepage&q&f=false —Preceding unsigned comment added by Linda Martens (talk • contribs) 02:18, 20 August 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Go for it. — Æµ§œš¹ _{[ãːɱ ˈfɹ̠ˤʷɪ̃ə̃nlɪ]} 22:42, 17 March 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Another Tamil vowel[edit]

(mistakenly put in the article by 59.178.168.154)

There is another vowel in Tamil which usually occurs word-finally. It is an unrounded closed back vowel denoted in IPA by ɯ. This vowel is different from its rounded counterpart ʊ. eg: The English word 'book' would be pronounced as [bʊkˑɯ]. It will not be pronounced as either [bʊkˑə] or as [bʊkˑʊ]. --PLEASE INCORPORATE THE SAME IN THE TABLE-- by Freelance Phonologist

Do you have a source? — Æµ§œš¹ _{[ãːɱ ˈfɹ̠ˤʷɪ̃ə̃nlɪ]} 13:41, 29 March 2013 (UTC)[reply]

I remember seeing this phenomenon mentioned in Krishnamurti (2003), The Dravidian Languages. It is certainly automatic and not a full phoneme, and it never occurs anywhere else than word-finally after a consonant. It is best described as a paragogic vowel. --Florian Blaschke (talk) 01:38, 23 July 2014 (UTC)[reply]

The phenomenon is called 'குற்றியல் உகரம்' (kurriyal ukaram, lit. 'short u') in Tamil grammar textbooks, FWIW. Kishore G (talk) 04:57, 19 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I just noticed the Tamil Wikipedia has an article on it. Kishore G (talk) 04:59, 19 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Already mentioned here in the section on Elision. Sorry for the noise. Kishore G (talk) 05:02, 19 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Aspirated and voiced stops[edit]

There is information in this article that suggests that there are no aspirated or voiced stops in Tamil. This is plain wrong and there are words (albeit few) with them. I would suggest that everyone help in finding such words and provide the information needed to rectify that point. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Razr99 (talk • contribs) 17:39, 29 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Self-contradiction[edit]

This page has the same issue as Tamil language, described here [[t̪ɐmɨɻ ]].---- Calthinus (talk) 17:40, 25 June 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Shouldn't அ be [ə] and not [a]?[edit]

I have no idea where [a] comes from because to my knowledge it does not even exist in the Tamil language. The source given describes it as such but contradicts itself when describing it as [ə] in the "transcribed passage]" which is given in it. SourceIsOpen (talk) 04:08, 29 September 2020 (UTC)[reply]

SpT, StT[edit]

The page mentions "SpT" a few times and "StT" at least once, without definining those abbreviations. (Presumably something like "spoken Tamil" versus "standard Tamil"?)

I'm guessing that this is due to quoting from a particular source which used (and defined!) those abbreviations.

Could the abbreviations please be defined at least once, or expanded everywhere they are used? - pne (talk) 15:36, 21 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]

@Pne: Schiffman uses LT for literary Tamil and ST for Spoken Tamil, I think using LT and ST would be better but how do you define an abbreviation? is there a template for that? AleksiB 1945 (talk) 08:58, 17 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Gnothidichselbst (talk) 09:01, 15 October 2022 (UTC) I expanded all abbreviations for clarity (it was driving me crazy as well).[reply]

Fixes (Feb 2023)[edit]

Tamil does contrast [nɡ ɳɡ ŋɡ] as in nān̠ku kaṇkaḷ and nīṅkaḷ but doesnt have [mg], /mk/ becomes [ŋɡ] as in suffixed maram-kaḷ > [maɾaŋɡaɭ] so should /nk/s with [ŋg] be changed to /mk/? also many like Krishnamurti considers [n] to be the allophone of /n̪/ instead of the other way as alveolars cant begin a word but n does occur initially.

On dialectical /tʃ/, (some) Brahmin dialects have [ʃ] as in pēcu as [pe:ʃɯ] instead of [peːsɯ] and [ʃaɾi] instead of [saɾi] but I dont have a source to back it. AleksiB 1945 (talk) 20:19, 3 February 2023 (UTC)[reply]

What about accent?[edit]

The words ‘stress’ and ‘accent’ are nowhere to be found here, and that’s fairly crucial for an article on this topic. Is Tamil weight-to-stress? Fixed stress? Does it even have stress or rather pitch accent? שונרא (talk) 23:49, 1 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]