Wikipedia:Peer review/Colorado Avalanche/archive2

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Colorado Avalanche[edit]

I've worked on this one some time ago. It had almost 0 references. I re-wrote it a bit, put a lot of references every time it needed. I have not edited it for some time, but other users did. I'd like to know what could be done to make the article better. It is a GA right now, and, although I'm not saying that's the point of having this Peer Review, it'd be good if we could make it to FA status. Well, just point out what could be done to improve this, no matter how little it is. Thanks--Serte [ Talk · Contrib ] 21:00, 10 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Jayron32's review[edit]

Unencyclopedic tone in places: *Quebec City was by far the smallest market in the league, and many players (including Lindros) were skittish about playing in a virtually unilingual francophone city. Skittish? Plus, this sentance is unreferenced. Where does it come from? *turned the Nordiques from an also-ran also-ran??? *Led by captain Joe Sakic, forward Peter Forsberg, and defenseman Adam Foote, Colorado entered their first season in Denver with a strong lineup and an intrigued fan base. Intrigued? Can you read their minds?

  • This series also ended with Martin Brodeur losing the Stanley Cup to his boyhood idol and Avalanche goalie, Patrick Roy. Boyhood idol? Is that necessary? If so, it is unreferenced.

*In 2003, the Avalanche thrillingly came back in the standings Thrillingly? Adverbs are NOT your friend. Avoid such peacock terms. Simply report the facts. Do so in an engaging way, but always maintain the proper neutral tone. *The second last game of the season was particularly exciting Again, according to whom? The writer's own opinion? *The elation of getting the record was short lived however ugh....

  • More copyediting is needed in MANY places. I am NOT a good copyeditor myself, but this needs extensive work from The League of Copyeditors. I highly recommend listing this article there for a copyedit.

Unbalanced coverage: *The history section gives WAY too much emphasis on a few events, like the Lindros draft & trade and the Roy trade. While I agree these are significant events, they DOMINATE the history article. Was NOTHING else from these time periods worthy of mention? *The rivalry with the red wings spends considerable space dealing with a single fight. Notable to mention, not notable enough to dwell on... *The records section only lists season records back to the franchise move to Colorado, but the individual records covers the Quebec years as well. This seems inconsistent... *No treatment is given to Denver's prior NHL franchise, the Colorado Rockies I would not expect a LOT of treatment, but I would expect the article to at least mention them.

Referencing issues:

  • The last several paragraphs of 2001 and beyond are unreferenced.
  • Most of the rivalry section is unreferenced. To be honest, most of this section could go. Any information here can be folded into the history section anwyays.
  • Honored members is mostly unreferenced.

That should give you a start on fixes needed.

Thanks a lot. Several of the issues were (I hope) fixed, but not all. all the mentions about the unencyclopedic tone were changed, with the exception of the particularly exciting. It is explained and backed with a reference that the game was particularly exciting because the team had to win and scored the winning goal 10 seconds before the end of a sudden death overtime. Anyway, this is still up to discussion. The history section will need a rewrite, I think it's poor, specially the part after the move. The Rivalry with the Red Wings was reduced. I'm not sure about what to do in the records section and I can tell you why: the individual records have as the title: Franchise individual records and that includes the Quebec Nordiques. I'm not sure on what is the policy is, I will research it. The Colorado Rockies now have a mention in the part about the move to Denver. The honored members section has references, I think that's enough. I will hope to deal with the other unreferenced parts later as they will require more time. I will submit the article to the The League of Copyeditors as you suggested. Thanks a lot for your review.--Serte [ Talk · Contrib ] 17:49, 11 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]
I have struck through the items that were fixed or explained better. The article still needs some work, but it is MUCH improving. Some organizational issues I spotted:
  • The roster is listed twice. Is that necessary?
  • Might it be appropriate to list the history of assisstant captains as well as captains? Since Sakic has been the captain for so long, it would help flesh out the article.
  • I am still a bit leary about excluding the Nordiques years from certain sections. I always understood (and I could be wrong, but this was my impression) that, except in unusual cases like the Baltimore Ravens or the San Jose Sharks, a franchise maintained the rights to the history of their former incarnations. Thus, the Nordiques aren't considered a distinct franchise from the Avalanche; the Avalanche are entitled to all of the records and history back to 1972 as part of their own franchise culture. It would be nice if the lists of things like captains and head coaches reflected this (if it is indeed true).
  • While we're at it, the captains and head coaches sections would be better served as a table than as a bullet list, n'est pas?
Well, good luck. This is getting better, and I look forward to future improvements. --Jayron32|talk|contribs 18:18, 11 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]
  • The roster template has been removed.
  • I would insert that information about alternate captains, if only I had it or knew where to find.
  • If you say that the franchises maintain the rights (and all that...), the records going back to the nordiques time should not be deleted. It's hard to decide. If you look at the Featured Article New Jersey Devils, you'll see that there's no individual record from the time before the move to New Jersey (but that's probably because all the records of the franchised were set after that move) and there's not a listing of the captains nor head coaches of the Colorado and Kansas City times.
  • I'd only put a table in head coaches if we had stats for them. And I think that's probably easy to do, you just have to see the teams season records and the seasons they worked on. I'll try to do that later.
Thanks once again for your input.--Serte [ Talk · Contrib ] 18:49, 11 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]
What do you think of the table in the head coaches section?--Serte [ Talk · Contrib ] 19:27, 11 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Things are looking up. Maybe the whole Nordiques/Avalanche issues is being blown out of proportion. I never wanted the Nordiques statistics REMOVED. I wanted them ADDED to places where they were missing. If you feel that this is adequately dealt with in the Nordiques article anyways, so be it. I dig the coaches table. Maybe the captains table can be added for consistancy. I KNOW it will be short, but it won't be short for ever... And WRT the alternate captains, none of the hockey DB sites list this? Hmmm. I am most familiar in dealing with the football database sites, and many of those are VERY detailed. I am surprised that information is not out there. I believe you, but am still suprised.--Jayron32|talk|contribs 03:09, 12 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]
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