User talk:Sillyfolkboy/Archive 6

If you wish to discuss any of the topics listed below then please send me a new message on my talk page.

What about {{Infobox athletics event}}?

You had decided to create it? It would be very useful. --Kasper2006 (talk) 16:18, 5 January 2013 (UTC)

(talk page stalker) Responded at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Athletics. --Redrose64 (talk) 20:38, 5 January 2013 (UTC)

Template:Medal

Do you think it is a good idea to distinguish between athletes disqualified for their own actions and athletes disqualified for the actions of a teammate? I have tried to get some input here if you're interested. 88.88.165.222 (talk) 15:21, 19 January 2013 (UTC) Thanks for your input. I'm a little unclear about what you meant by add a reference. Where will the footnote be added when it is in an infobox? Won't it mess with the template? 88.88.165.222 (talk) 17:45, 19 January 2013 (UTC)

I've made a change to Michael Johnson (sprinter) to demonstrate the idea of explanatory notes (change here). The format of the template makes things relatively simple to do, fortunately! SFB 18:17, 19 January 2013 (UTC)

Thanks. I spotted it just now. It seems to be a very good solution. Should it be added to the template documentation as a suggestion for other relay cases? 88.88.165.222 (talk) 18:23, 19 January 2013 (UTC)

Category:Female athletes

Your own opinionin this discussion. ;-) --Kasper2006 (talk) 14:01, 21 January 2013 (UTC)

For your experience

I may make sense the request for invert redirect from Category:Long-distance runners to Category:Long distance runners as is Category:Middle distance runners? --Kasper2006 (talk) 15:12, 22 January 2013 (UTC)

This is a long-standing difference since the articles for Long-distance track event and middle distance track event were created over ten years ago. This is only a typographical difference: both with hypen and without are acceptable. It will require quite a lot of work to make these two article titles match up and there are no compelling reasons to do it (hence why it remains unmoved after ten years). It would be a good idea to start a discussion at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Athletics or request a move at middle distance running before making such a laborious change. SFB 21:01, 22 January 2013 (UTC)

And, if you want, see also this discussion. I think that the fact that it remains unmoved after ten years should not affect. If something is wrong it is right to correct. ;-) --Kasper2006 (talk) 08:25, 23 January 2013 (UTC)

Template:International athletics: Race Walking

Hi SFB! Welcome back. I tried to incorporate some race walking events into Template:International athletics. There might be better solutions. Appreciate your comments. Thanks. CroesJ (talk) 22:04, 3 February 2013 (UTC)

Middle-distance running

Per your previous comments in Talk:Long-distance running#Requested move, please see Talk:Middle distance running#Suggested move. Thanks! Location (talk) 19:14, 4 February 2013 (UTC)

Arapian

Review done.Proudbolsahye (talk) 18:20, 27 February 2013 (UTC)

Categories for discussion

Please remember to tag every category that you list for discussion. The ones that you listed at Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2013 January 26#Track and field athletes by event, nationality and gender were not tagged at all. If the instructions at WP:CFD are not clear or do not work, I would be happy to advise. – Fayenatic London 21:32, 27 February 2013 (UTC)

Article Feedback deployment

Hey Sillyfolkboy; I'm dropping you this note because you've used the article feedback tool in the last month or so. On Thursday and Friday the tool will be down for a major deployment; it should be up by Saturday, failing anything going wrong, and by Monday if something does :). Thanks, Okeyes (WMF) (talk) 23:44, 13 March 2013 (UTC)

Invitation to join the Darius Dhlomo Drive

Hello. You are invited to join Darius Dhlomo Drive, a project which aims to cleanup and resolve one of the oldest copyright investigations on the sire. We hope that you will join and help to clean what's left of the copyright violations. You are getting this invitation because you have helped out previously, and I am inviting you back to hopefully wrap this up. Wizardman 01:36, 14 April 2013 (UTC)

Hyphens part deux

I commented about hyphens at: User talk:EdJohnston re: Florence Griffith JoynerTrackinfo (talk) 05:08, 20 April 2013 (UTC)

Rename

I commented at User talk:Anthony Appleyard#Rename. Trackinfo (talk) 17:22, 21 April 2013 (UTC)

Meeting Herculis

A tag has been placed on Meeting Herculis, requesting that it be speedily deleted from Wikipedia. This has been done under the criteria for speedy deletion, because it is a redirect to a nonexistent page, or a redirect loop.

If you can fix this redirect to point to an existing Wikipedia page, please do so and remove the speedy deletion tag. However, please do not remove the speedy deletion tag unless you also fix the redirect. Feel free to leave a note on my talk page if you have any questions about this. - Camyoung54 talk 21:33, 22 April 2013 (UTC)

Talkback

Hello, Sillyfolkboy. You have new messages at Template:Did you know nominations/Shigga Shay.
Message added 05:41, 19 May 2013 (UTC). You can remove this notice at any time by removing the {{Talkback}} or {{Tb}} template.

☯ Bonkers The Clown \(^_^)/ Nonsensical Babble ☯ 05:41, 19 May 2013 (UTC)

Changing Tilly van der Made

Dear Sillyfolkboy, would you kindly help me in changing the article on Dutch former athlete Tilly van der Made into 'Tilly van der Zwaard'? Her marriage, started in 1964 with Van der Made, already ended in the 80's and since then she has returned to her maiden name. Besides, the most important part of her achievements in track and field athletics were delivered under her maiden name as well. I tried to change the article's title myself, but apparently (different from the Dutch wikipedia) I seem to have no authorization to do so. Thanks in advance. Regards, Piet.Wijker (talk) 09:38, 28 May 2013 (UTC)

Formatting issues

Hi SFB. I would like to draw your attention early to my recent edits of athlete's bios, e.g. here. Including the results of the ALBA Games into the achievements tables, I try to adopt the Manual of Style and to meet your objections from last year. Appreciate your comments.

Further question: how to deal with name ambiguities, i.e. results are published for Yojer Medina or Yoger Medina? CroesJ (talk) 11:44, 1 June 2013 (UTC)

Thanks for your quick answer. We share the same interests and agree on almost all points. Nevertheless: to my opinion, flags look more attractive and: "A picture paints a thousand words." Whenever you drag the mouse on a flag, the name of a country is displayed, and clicking on it brings you to the corresponding Wikipedia article. For me, this is quite easy. On the other hand: which user really knows the "Turks and Caicos Islands"? After reading, you also have to click, now on the text, to get more information.

A compromise might be to use "flagcountry" to display the country name rather than "flagicon".

The name issue: Brazilian/Portuguese names are another story. With respect to Cuban (but not only) athletes, you find, e.g., Arasay Tondike/Thondike/Thondique, or Noleysi/Noleysis Bicet/Vicet, Iosvani/Yosvany Suárez, just to name a few. Unfortunately, the evolution of search engines (Google, Wikipedia, ...) don't account anymore for these ambiguities, i.e., you enter "Arasay Thondique", you don't get any results for "Arasay Thondike" any more. The reason for the ambiguity might be that there is no difference in pronunciation, i.e., b/v, g/j, i/y, k/qu, and sometimes l/r are pronounced equally, and the final "s" is (often) omitted in the Spanish language as spoken in the region.

Therefore, I think it is some kind of a problem, and it is important to include all names in use within athlete's biographies. I started to use something like: "Noleysi Bicet (or Noleysis Vicet, born ...", but I am not pleased with it, and appreciate suggestions how to improve. CroesJ (talk) 20:32, 1 June 2013 (UTC)

Nomination for deletion of Template:FAI League of Ireland Premier Division 2008 Table

Template:FAI League of Ireland Premier Division 2008 Table has been nominated for deletion. You are invited to comment on the discussion at the template's entry on the Templates for discussion page. Kingjeff (talk) 17:56, 7 June 2013 (UTC)

You've Reverted Changes I've made

You've reverted changes I've made to the districts which have now become defunct and have been turned to Counties of Kenya as per the new Constitution of Kenya, I would like to know why. Actually dont mind I'll just create new pages for the counties.

Can't I create entirely new pages with my own research for the counties? Answer this question with a yes or no and give me a simple explanation. I already understood the fact that I couldn't move an entire page.

Nairobi County..

Hi SFB, I think you've inadvertently made Nairobi County a redirect to Nairobi (county) and not the other way around? I know these edits have been a bit of a mess so thanks for sorting it out.. Also my copyedit was clobbered (diff) Cheers, eug (talk) 10:39, 3 July 2013 (UTC)

Thanks SFB! It'd be nice if mediawiki could detect large text replacements and warn users.. eug (talk) 11:06, 3 July 2013 (UTC)

Olympic pole vault

No, sorry, I'm a bit busy to properly edit Wikipedia at the moment. Feel free to develop whatevers in my sandbox though, if it's of any value. (of course) It's great to see you back on Wikipedia by the way, the Athletics coverage wasn't the same without you. --Kafuffle (talk) 20:39, 3 July 2013 (UTC)

2009 Mediterranean Games medal table FLC

Hi Sillyfolkboy, if you would like to leave comments which concern you or would cast a vote in support or opposition based on your findings, I'd appreciate it a lot. This article has garnered several good (and resolved) reviews, but no votes have been cast. Thanks and regards. — Bill william compton^Talk 11:31, 8 July 2013 (UTC)

Deletion and redirection of the Athletics at the ... Games

Hi SFB!

The page Athletics at the Bolivarian Games (and others seem to be in process) was deleted and redirected to Bolivarian Games. Is this in agreement with the Wikipedia Athletics Project? CroesJ (talk) 10:25, 12 July 2013 (UTC)

Kenyan County RMs

Hi SFB, I'm beginning the long process of moving the Kenyan counties you requested at RM. Would you mind seeing to the renaming of the relevant categories? You can use speedy renaming, criterion C2D. --BDD (talk) 21:59, 15 July 2013 (UTC)

Nevermind. I've seen to this. --BDD (talk) 16:10, 17 July 2013 (UTC)

IAAF Hall of Fame

Here's a conversation you might wish to join. The IAAF Hall of Fame#Other athletes who match the criteria section has been removed by User:Prolog. The conversation first went to User talk:Prolog and is now moving to Wikipedia:No original research/Noticeboard#IAAF Hall of Fame where the discussion apparently will now continue. Your participation is invited. Trackinfo (talk) 22:18, 3 August 2013 (UTC)

SPATRA reactivation

Hello Sillyfolkboy, I notice that you were involved in the project Wikipedia:Spanish Translation of the Week a few years ago. However I also notice that here has been very little activity since 2007. This is a project I'm particularly interested in and would love to see it revived. I've taken the bold step of identifying an article requiring translation and I'm in the process of inviting collaboration. The article History of Puerta del Sol could really use your help. In addition, I'd welcome any ideas you may have to help revive this project so that there is greater collaboration among ES>EN translators on en.Wikipedia. I'm identifying various contributors from whom the SPATRA project may benefit. If you have any recommendations then feel free to contact them directly or submit there usernames to me via my talkpage. I look forward to your participation. Gratefully - EagerToddler39 (talk) 02:29, 22 September 2013 (UTC)

@EagerToddler39: Interestingly, I was thinking about the translation of good Spanish articles into English just a couple of days ago. This is something that remains a long-term interest of mine, but at the moment I'm still focusing on athletics content. My recent hiatus showed that many of the article types I currently expand or create just don't get done in by absence – there is a scarcity of dedicated editors on this topic. Good luck finding fellow Spanish/English speakers to help restart the translation effort. SFB 11:54, 22 September 2013 (UTC)

Thanks much for your response Sillfolkboy. All the best in your endeavours over there. I'm always shopping around for new ways to contribute so feel free to involve me in athletics content. And also feel free to drop by SPATRA whenever you are able to come up for some air from what you're currently working on. All the best. EagerToddler39 (talk) 19:27, 22 September 2013 (UTC)

International Cross

Thank you for the award.

A couple of remarks and issues on the subject:

- credit for Tomas Magnusson: he did the main work collecting all the data and deserves proper credit. In a personal publication, I would insert an "Acknowledgments" section, but on "public" pages as in Wikipedia, this appears to be inadequate. Any idea?

- contemporaneous newspaper reports on the events: this is the fun part of this project. Unfortunately, the major British papers (Times / Guardian / ...) want you to pay for using their archive, what is a pity. Therefore, I would like to support the Glasgow Herald supplying free access. Nevertheless, I only managed to link to the frontpage of the paper rather than to the specific page containing the information. Any solution to this problem?

- table in main article: I did not like the design at all. Therefore, I substituted the editions table... Hope this is OK?

- medals: I did not find any hint that there were medals awarded. Therefore, I dropped the "MedallistTable" approach in the main article substituting "Gold", "Silver", and "Bronze" by "First", "Second", and "Third". Hope this is OK?

- Ireland, political statements: I am not into the Ireland problem, so I did not comment on it although it appears to be necessary. The admission of a North Ireland team in 1933 obviously led to a boycott affecting the athletes from the south. Therefore, it does not appear to be established, that before, an All-Ireland team was participating. Especially the situation in 1921 is unclear.

- redlinks: I do not know, whether there are any guidelines. I introduced redlinks only for athletes that finished top-3 to avoid an inflation while publishing complete results. Hope this is OK? Moreover, a lot of "See also: year in athletics (track and field)" redlinks were generated. What to do with this?

- no prose: Appreciate you to add some prose to the articles.

- IAAF World Cross Country Championships: of course, it would be easy to proceed with modifying these pages, because all the framework is existing. Nevertheless, I am somewhat reluctant, because I would restructure existing pages destroying the hard work of others. And with a participation of 800+ athletes, the result could read like an old fashioned telephone directory. CroesJ (talk) 19:58, 8 October 2013 (UTC)

@CroesJ: To give credit to Tomas you could list his name in web citation like you would with a newspaper report. I often do this from ARRS citations, along as there's only one or two prominent authors to list. I recently raised this point in an email to Ken Young (the ARRS site admin) to make sure we're appropriately giving credit where it's due.

I've given a look at the newspaper links and you could try using the "Link to Article" feature on the right section of Google News and click the relevant headline to get a more specific link (e.g.). I completely agree about the pain of paywalls. It's understandable that companies need to get the money to support historical searches, but the prices I've seen are simply not good value for an individual (most access is probably paid for by institutions).

Your table on the main article is much better. No need to worry about that as mine was rather a slap-dash effort to make a starting point. The use of placings rather than medals makes better sense too. The Ireland question sounds tricky and probably requires a bit of research (I've no idea). If it's unclear what kind of Ireland was competing (All-Ireland or just one bit) then a simple unlinked "Ireland" with no flag should cover you.

Redlinks are welcome when it is reasonable that the subject could have an article. You've probably erred on the correct side of caution here just linking the top three if no article was present (it's hard to say much about an athlete who may have finished in the top 20 of this event a couple of times, if they didn't do much else). I've gone back and created the "year in athletics" categories you were missing (e.g. Category:1903 in athletics (track and field)). The simplest way to do these is to find a pre-existing similar category (say 1908), click edit and copy the contents from that, then just adjust the years to match the one you are creating.

A vast number of our athletics results articles have a lack of prose. I presume because it is more difficult to gather and interpret different sources than it is simply give the facts. I try to make a good attempt with prose when I have the time, but to be honest for every article where I've tried there is another where I've taken the easy way out. Prose can always be added later and the links can sometimes draw in other interested people.

I've been thinking about revising the IAAF World Cross Country articles for some time now. I used the 2010 article as a kind of experiment to try to work out what a full coverage article for these types of event would look like. On the results side of things, I just listed the top twelve in each race to keep things on point and at a manageable size. However there were plenty of notables beyond that cutoff (Mo Farah at no. 20 to say the least!). Perhaps it would make sense to have an abridged listing on the main page then we could have a link to a sub-page to give exhaustive results like 2010 IAAF World Cross Country Championships – Men's senior race. There isn't any real difference between doing something like that for cross country, compared to 2007 World Champs Marathon for example. @Pietaster: - would this type of project be of any interest to you as well? SFB 22:08, 8 October 2013 (UTC)

Thanks for the invite but currently I have an enormous backlog of events that I would like to see covered in detail and with the new academic year not so much time on my hands. I do, however, fully support full coverage of World Cross Country Championships. Pietaster (talk) 16:34, 9 October 2013 (UTC)

Seeing as CroesJ has started work on the race articles, I've created a {{World Cross Country Championships}} template. Note the usage of the endash in the title (alt+0150 on the keyboard or you can just click the red links now). SFB 20:30, 10 October 2013 (UTC)

First of all, thank you for comprehensive answers to my points, especially for your assistance with the Google News articles. The work on the 1973 IAAF World Cross Country Championships was primarily thought as a first draft and was still quite buggy. I appreciate any comments for improvement. CroesJ (talk) 22:59, 10 October 2013 (UTC)

They look like a good start to me. Nothing major missing, though I suppose you could add an overall medal table section. As you said before, some more prose would fill out the articles a bit more. One difference I notice from my 2010 attempt was that you listed all the team members for the top eight team, whereas I listed the individuals for the top three teams only. Space-wise, this means the coverage of an individual race is equal to that of the seventh and eighth place teams in that race. Not a big issue per-se (or one you need to fix if you disagree), but I intentionally tried to balance the two tables to be roughly equal. SFB 19:07, 11 October 2013 (UTC)

Thanks for the recognition of my work on the cross country championships. I will be out for the rest of the year. CroesJ (talk) 22:18, 18 November 2013 (UTC)

@CroesJ: You have already given more than your fair share for one year – you've made a tangible improvement to the topic area, which takes some going! I hope you enjoy whatever you have planned for the rest of the year. It can be good to re-prioritise sometimes. I found editing more enjoyable after a break to focus on a computer course at the start of this year. A balanced life is often a happy one! Take care. SFB 19:29, 19 November 2013 (UTC)

DYK

Hi, would you mind if I nominated Ruth Wanjiru for DYK, or were you planning to do it? Thanks, Matty.007 10:57, 26 October 2013 (UTC)

@Matty.007: Be my guest! I used to nominate quite a few of my articles for DYK, but less so recently. Now I only do it when something particularly piques my interest in the subject. I would probably focus on her Eindhoven Marathon win, or perhaps the Japanese scholarship (I've been meaning to learn more about Japanese running scholarships and company teams but most of the good source material is in Japanese so it will take a lot of work). SFB 11:05, 26 October 2013 (UTC)

Thanks, the link is at this page. I have messed up the formatting somewhere, but have asked for help from an expert. Thanks, Matty.007 13:32, 26 October 2013 (UTC)

You are now a template editor

Your account has been granted the template editor user right, allowing you to edit templates and modules that have been protected with template protection. It also allows you to bypass the title blacklist, giving you the ability to create and edit edit notices.

You can use this user right to perform maintenance, answer edit requests, and make any other simple and generally uncontroversial edits to templates, modules, and edit notices. You can also use it to enact more complex or controversial edits, after those edits are first made to a test sandbox, and their technical reliability as well as their consensus among other informed editors has been established.

Before you use this user right, please read Wikipedia:Template editor and make sure you understand its contents. In particular, you should read the section on wise template editing and the criteria for revocation. This user right gives you access to some of Wikipedia's most important templates and modules; it is critical that you edit them wisely and that you only make edits that are backed up by consensus. It is also very important that no one else be allowed to access your account, so you should consider taking a few moments to secure your password.

If you do not want this user right, you may ask any administrator to remove it for you at any time.

Useful links:

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Happy template editing! — Mr. Stradivarius ^{♪ talk ♪} 21:53, 18 December 2013 (UTC)

• Thanks @Mr. Stradivarius:. I'm sure this will save you some time personally too! SFB 21:59, 18 December 2013 (UTC)

Removal of Some Spartan information on "Melbourne Marathon Spartans" page

Hi

I notice that you removed information for all Spartans other than the 10 current Legends? Any reason for this, because I would like to re-instate those names?

Djfoskey (talk) 09:47, 22 December 2013 (UTC)

@Djfoskey: The first reason was that I couldn't find a source for the names – without a source it becomes impossible to manage such lists. The second reason was that the names I removed did not seem to adhere to the rule of having completed every marathon. If the definition of a "Spartan" is not someone who has completed every marathon, then we should change that to "a select group of runners who have completed a large number of Melbourne marathons". SFB 09:52, 22 December 2013 (UTC)

Hi Sorry, if I break some of the rules in this response. A Spartan is someone who has completed 10 Melbourne Marathons - see qualifications section above the section you changed. We had listed all Spartans who have completed more than 30. The Legends are a special case of this.

The Melbourne Marathon Spartans site, www.melbournemarathonspartans.com is the official site of the Spartans club and recognised by the organisers of the marathon itself. It is listed in the External Links section of the page. I will add those names back in, but use your table layout which is a considerable improvement.

Thanks Djfoskey (talk) 07:36, 23 December 2013 (UTC)

@Djfoskey: It all looks fine to me. Thanks for explaining the Spartans definition. Listing of the 1000+ Spartans is almost certainly better left to the website to handle, rather than here(!). It might make sense to restore a Hall of Fame section for the runners who have completed over 30 Melbourne Marathons using this as a reference:

<ref>[http://melbournemarathonspartans.com/hall-of-fame/ Hall of Fame]. Melbourne Marathon. Retrieved on 2013-12-23.</ref>

By the way, breaking rules is pretty much the way you learn about things here! Anyone worth their salt will take their time to explain Wikipedia's (many, many) foibles. Fortunately, I'm here because of a love of marathons and not a love of rules! SFB 19:01, 23 December 2013 (UTC)

DYK: Miki Imai (athlete) & Wu Shujiao

Hello, Sillyfolkboy. Happy New Year! I thought I should let you know that these two wikipages started by you a few days ago have been nominated for DYK here and here. Thank you for your new addition to Wikipedia. Happy editing. Cheers! --PFHLai (talk) 04:00, 2 January 2014 (UTC)

@PFHLai: Thanks for taking the time to nominate these on my behalf. I know it can take up quite a bit of time writing and reviewing DYKs. I appreciate you bringing the articles to a wider audience. Thanks! SFB 18:36, 2 January 2014 (UTC)

Thanks

Thanks for your help too, the categorizing by which college one went to could make it easier for people to search them up. Inevitably there will be some amazing athletes that will be overlooked but I figure I could at least start stubs/shorter articles on ones that I heard of Zastavafan76 (talk) 20:07, 14 January 2014 (UTC)

swimmer

are you sure about this? seems dubious that a swimmer would be competing in wrestling. Frietjes (talk) 19:39, 30 January 2014 (UTC)

@Frietjes: My mistake – I was disambiguating a number of Aleksandr Ivanov links and must have misread freestyle wrestling as freestyle swimming. Thanks for fixing it for me! SFB 10:15, 31 January 2014 (UTC)

Nomination for deletion of Template:Infobox Olympic athletics event

Template:Infobox Olympic athletics event has been nominated for deletion. You are invited to comment on the discussion at the template's entry on the Templates for discussion page. eh bien mon prince (talk) 23:26, 31 January 2014 (UTC)

Indoors/Outdoors

You reverted my edit on 3000 metres. Technically that is correct, she did run indoors and our WP list says Outdoors. I was taking an extension of IAAF Rule 260-18a see it here on page 257 that yes, applies to records. The statement "with or without roof" nullifies the concept of "outdoors" and simply make those events the named events. If that one race in the 1993 Chinese National Games were to be nullified (maybe Wang's new book will admit to the chemicals she and all of her teammates were using . . . ) this indoor mark would become the World Record. So by limiting the list to events held without a roof, Wikipedia is out of touch with the way the marks are regarded by the worldwide governing body. This is a further reaching discussion than just this 3000 meters list and might apply across how we list best performances in all other events. Trackinfo (talk) 21:34, 7 February 2014 (UTC)

@Trackinfo: I saw the edit and I presumed this was an interpretation of this rule amendment – While I can see where you're coming from, I think it makes more sense to show separate outdoor and indoor lists. Essentially, the IAAF is saying that the outright "World record" can be set either indoors or outdoors. It doesn't say that indoor times are outdoor times (the IAAF outdoor top lists still exclude indoor marks). In a way, the IAAF is just saying the best outdoor mark isn't necessarily the world record for the event. Thus Bubka's 6.15m indoors is the World Record and World Indoor Record, while his 6.14m is just the World Outdoor Record (as this link suggests). For clarity it might make sense to highlight whether the world record is the best outdoor or indoor mark. However, I think it's more confusing to include indoor times in sections headed "outdoor". SFB 22:56, 7 February 2014 (UTC)

Also - In terms of our Chinese friends, my summary of Chinese Games athletics is probably a good indication of my thoughts on this :)

I explained the Bubka situation at List of world records in athletics#Outdoor world records; the rule was put into place ex post facto and was not retroactive. So that's not a good example. And as I explained at Genzebe Dibaba#Career, the tighter indoor turns do prove to be disadvantageous, but Dibaba and Mary Cain keep having superhuman performances indoors anyhow. Elite pole vaulters, as exampled by Renaud Lavillenie recently, but throughout history, have preferred jumping indoors. Many vaulters have their PRs indoors, including Bubka. Were it not for the Beamonesque career advancements of Bubka and Isinbayeva, removing their names, both mens and women's world records in the Pole Vault would be indoors right now (Lavillenie and Suhr). We could very well have a world record set indoors and then Wikipedia "outdoor" lists would seem rather arbitrarily discriminating--not showing the ratified world record because there was a roof. I know, a slippery slope argument, but that's what the rule book allows. Trackinfo (talk) 03:56, 8 February 2014 (UTC)

@Trackinfo: I suppose my argument is that our lists are currently divided into "outdoor" and "indoor" sections, rather than "world record" and "world indoor record" sections. Obviously, as things are now, it would be a bit tiresome to have outdoor, indoor and outright record sections (as the outright and outdoor sections would be duplicates). Perhaps this is better managed with colouration or a symbol on the list denoting which of the outdoor and indoor marks are the outright records? I'm conscious that this is a technical point which will confuse, rather than inform, readers if we don't have a easily understood approach. SFB 11:16, 8 February 2014 (UTC)

When it comes to making the public understand details . . . we're in trouble. We have a few very knowledgeable readers and the vast majority are utterly clueless about our sport. As the Athletics project as a whole, its our job to try to inform. That's why many of my comments try to put things in perspective. So this is a subject that needs to find a means of presentation, now or in the future. Trackinfo (talk) 00:28, 9 February 2014 (UTC)

100 metres at the Olympics

Hi Sillyfolkboy. I see that you begin to create the different disciplines in the Olympics. The first "100 meters at the Olympics" is very complete, congratulations. I created all disciplines on wp: fr there a few months, you can use my data if you wish (progressions Olympic records in particular, still incomplet unfortunately), and link with Wikidata. Best regards and see you soon. --Selligpau (talk) 16:09, 8 February 2014 (UTC)

@Selligpau: I remember seeing your French articles a few years ago. To be honest I'd forgot about them, but they probably inspired me subconsciously! I just need to write the history for the Olympic 100 m, then I'll probably submit it for review. I'm only building basic versions for the other events, initially. I like the idea of exploring what a "complete" article might look like. There is certainly a lot to read!

Thanks for reminding me. I will make use of your information and link with wikidata where it is possible – I'm taking slightly different options on some articles (e.g. "sprint hurdles" will include 110m, 100m and 80m events for completeness). Nice to hear from you! SFB 16:40, 8 February 2014 (UTC)

Deletion of redlinks from Template:National Members of the International Association of Athletics Federations

Hi SFB! Appreciate your opinion and comments on this problem. Thanks. CroesJ (talk) 14:19, 12 February 2014 (UTC)

Nav boxes

WP:Redlink does not apply to Nav Boxes as Nav Boxes has its own policy to supersede. After reading the discussion on the talk page I see a lot of IDONTLIKEIT. I personally find the part of a series a) in this instance is used too broadly. I series of articles implies a form of sequence (like a part 1, part 2, part 3 etc), of which there is none in a collection of Athletics organisations and b) superseded by there being most of the Box being red and there not be a rapid pace of increase in article production.

Using the "part of a series" this broadly could be applied essentially to every navbox ever made, it is a touch

This being the most important bit: the function of a navbox is to easily connect a whole bunch of similar articles and not to be used at a substitute for a list article, nor as a prod for editors to create more articles where a list article can perform the exact same function with creating for the casual reader a huge pile of "article not createds". It is a tool for navigating wikipedia, not content. --Falcadore (talk) 01:18, 13 February 2014 (UTC)

Template:Did you know nominations/100 metres at the Olympics

See review - this is an excellent article. There a few paragraphs that have no source, which according to the DYK rules must to be fixed. Aymatth2 (talk) 15:36, 14 February 2014 (UTC)

@Aymatth2: Already approved but I've cited as appropriate per your advice anyway. Thanks! SFB 19:36, 16 February 2014 (UTC)

Sainsbury's Indoor Grand Prix

Declined as a technical move, without prejudice to refiling with more evidence. It's true that a name without the sponsor would be more logical, but in a quick Google, I didn't find your proposed name 'Birmingham Indoor Grand Prix', to be actually in use. This Google hit suggests that 'British Athletics Indoor Grand Prix' is a possibility. What do you think? EdJohnston (talk) 03:24, 23 February 2014 (UTC)

@EdJohnston: I agree that is another possibility, though it carries the issue of being confused with the Glasgow event[1] also hosted by British Athletics. The Birmingham version is in use in mainstream pressBBCGuardianChina DailyYahoo. What do you think? SFB 12:36, 23 February 2014 (UTC)

OK, at least Yahoo uses 'Birmingham Indoor Grand Prix' as a proper name though the other two do not. None of the three uses 'Sainsbury.' I went ahead and did the move to Birmingham Indoor Grand Prix. If there is any disagreement, a move discussion can be opened. Thanks, EdJohnston (talk) 13:12, 24 February 2014 (UTC)

Thanks for your help. The previous titles have been in contravention of WP:POVNAME. I will pick up the conversation if there is any dispute. Cheers. SFB 22:03, 24 February 2014 (UTC)

James Kwesi Appiah

Not sure where you've got the DOB from? GiantSnowman 13:19, 2 March 2014 (UTC)

Transfermarkt is not a RS, see WP:RSN. GiantSnowman 15:59, 2 March 2014 (UTC)

@GiantSnowman: OK. Feel free to delete it as I don't really have an interest in that article anyway. Thanks. SFB

Why are you guys such crybabies re: edits?

Gosh, just about every edition I try to do on here gets reverted or at least complained about by you resistant, stubborn, whiny crybabies! What the hell is supposedly "wrong" with fixing the naming order of something like from "Winter Olympic Games" to the CORRECT "Olympic Winter Games," and not explaining it, especially when that adjustment it just conforming to what the AUTHORITY on the matter (the organizations themselves)? Who are you to think you have "more authority" to say how something is or should be written out as than the organizations who created and are in charge of it? Why should I have to offer any discussion explanation for something that just follows what the authorities already have?

GEESH! Why must we have to have editors who insist on being such crybabies over so many things? "NOO, don't fix the errors in my precious article! REVERT! I want it back to the WRONG way!" GOSH! It's so ridiculous!

"Maxx Fordham"

I hope you do not get provoked Sillyfolkboy. Maxx has a tendency to throw these kind of tantrums when he does not get his way. I have told him at his talk page that this is not a matter of wrong or right it is a matter of Wikipedia guidelines concerning name changes. --BabbaQ (talk) 10:24, 13 March 2014 (UTC)

Hi Maxx - if the outcome is indisputably right then you won't see any opposition at a move request. If you have good solid arguments and sources to back it up then your changes will stand. That's what happened when I moved European Athletics Championships with quite a similar reason to yourself. If usage is mixed however (as appears the case with the Olympic articles), then it's good to hear other opinions to come to a decision of what's best. If that doesn't sound like a good idea to you then you will struggle as at heart this is a community project. In that case, your efforts may be better directed towards something more individual, like a blog or personal website. Take care. SFB 11:18, 15 March 2014 (UTC)

Template:Did you know nominations/2014 Tokyo Marathon

Hello, Sillyfolkboy. I thought I should let you know that 2014 Tokyo Marathon, a wikiarticle recently started by you, is now nominated for DYK. Thank you for your wikicontributions. Happy editing. Cheers! --PFHLai (talk) 21:00, 29 March 2014 (UTC)

Thanks for the nomination PFHLai. I was planning to do a bit more work on the article, but haven't found the time yet. Cheers! SFB 07:42, 31 March 2014 (UTC)

You're welcome, SFB. It looks like this DYK will be on MainPage tomorrow. Cheers! --PFHLai (talk) 23:39, 8 April 2014 (UTC)

Wikidata-centric citations

You made a good point at the village pump. This is relevant to all language versions of Wikipedia (not to mention Wikidata). However, I don't have much experience with the processes off-Wikipedia and would appreciate some guidance. You mentioned bringing the discussion to WikiData or Meta. Is there any reason I should prefer moving it to WikiData over Meta? Would it be a breach of protocol copy & paste the discussion to that Meta page you linked? —Sowlos  03:44, 9 April 2014 (UTC)

@Sowlos: Sorry for the slow response – I think a link back rather than a copy-paste would be a better way to start the meta conversation. SFB 20:33, 17 April 2014 (UTC)

Silver medal

Much appreciate your intervention on Silver medal, that Ottawa anon user 99.224.51.134 is going on a revert rampage, due to the argument of the user being a sockpuppet, without even looking at the edit in question. If you can rally a few more editors to stop this anon nonsence, that would be great. 142.205.241.254 (talk) 16:13, 14 April 2014 (UTC)

MOSFLAG

Thanks for your comments - although I obviously have my own opinion, I can see both sides of the debate. However this is about compromise and a good one is definitely out there. I like my own idea (obviously!) of flags combined with trigramme, but am more than happy to listen to as many opinions as possible. GiantSnowman 19:13, 14 April 2014 (UTC)

Sprint finish listed at Redirects for discussion

An editor has asked for a discussion to address the redirect Sprint finish. Since you had some involvement with the Sprint finish redirect, you might want to participate in the redirect discussion if you have not already done so. LukeSurl ^{t c} 10:18, 15 April 2014 (UTC)

Flags for physiotherapists

In what way do you believe my "berating" of use of flags for managers and physiotherapists is disagreeable to you? MOS:FLAG currently defines quite reasonable use of flags in sports articles, and while there is nothing in your proposal per se that I disagree with, the waft of text does not seem to add anything productive to the guideline that isn't written or implied already. And I fear it will do little to reduce the [ab]use of flag icons across the project. -- Ohc ^¡digame! 01:26, 19 May 2014 (UTC)

@Ohconfucius: It's disappointing because you used it as an argument against the proposals, when the proposal is specifically designed to prevent such usage. As for whether it will make a difference: virtually all editors focused on sports editing seem to feel it's a useful idea. Although it may seem redundant, I think it makes more sense to discuss the proposal at the shared MOS page – essentially this could have been discussed at WikiProject level, but that would actually remove input from anyone else and facilitate people to make concessions for their own topic area (which is precisely what I'm trying to avoid). SFB 06:38, 19 May 2014 (UTC)

Your proposal

I've decided to reply here, as I am growing exasperated by the increasingly unpleasant attitude shown by a number of editors involved in the flags discussion, and have no particular desire to make any comments on the talk page that may invite further responses from those editors. Quite why debates about flags stir such passions is beyond me, but it's becoming increasingly apparent that the issue somehow makes normally logical editors completely lose the ability to debate in a pleasant or rational manner. With the exception of the "everyone who disagrees with this proposal is a chauvinist pig" farce that a RM on the Australian football team descended into, I don't think I've been involved in such a horrible discussion for several years.

But anyway, in basic terms, some people have (erroneously) claimed that flags are not needed in squad lists because nationality is not relevant to club football. Your proposal (particularly the line "Where nationality is irrelevant to the sport,") does nothing to stop this line of debate, because those people will still trot out the same argument. Number 57 20:11, 19 May 2014 (UTC)

That point really boils down to the disputed usages: either (a) one or both are valid usages, or (b) we remove the "almost" from the phrase "this almost exclusively relates to international competitions". I've tried to demonstrate the logic behind the disputed usages – it is there, and is actually pretty solid, though I feel editors favouring such usage have never really explained themselves very well. I don't feel massively strongly either way to be honest.

It's often minor issues that people get most wound up about. The date de-linking issue was the same. Reasonable discussion seems to deteriorate quite quickly as people get sucked into debating weak arguments or respond to statements clearly designed to rattle a few cages. Normally I quietly work away on my own writing new articles, but from time to time it's required to get involved in these difficult conversations in order to bring things forward. It's ironic that editors so vehemently and uncompromisingly opposed to any flag usage do not see how they are partly responsible for the years of terrible usage in the sports topic area. Hopefully my efforts can help change that. SFB 21:03, 19 May 2014 (UTC)

Quite. Compromise doesn't seem to be a word in some people's vocabulary, so unfortunately I can't see the current discussion actually going anywhere, even with people like yourself attempting to do something useful. The sad thing is that looking at the contributions of the worst offenders in this debate, they appear to be heavily involved in all kinds of MOS guidelines, which is rather concerning to say the least. I am beginning to get the feeling that these sorts of editors who are obsessed with imposing their personal stylistic preferences over every area of Wikipedia (whether suitable or not) are slowly wearing down (and pushing out) everyone else, and that eventually only the most persistent (and offensive) editors will be left remaining. This is what I have seen happen in some of the more contentious fields of nationalist debate, and it's not good. Number 57 21:42, 19 May 2014 (UTC)

on meta

feel free to comment on topics about funding chapters, etc. at https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Talk:Funds_Dissemination_Committee_Advisory_Group/Meeting_3 for the FDC Advisory Group meeting to be held this this Sunday and Monday. Though it's unlikely we'd discuss specific people's salaries - general questions of effectiveness, FDC operations, the future of diversified spending of Wikimedia funds will almost certainly be discussed. Smallbones_(smalltalk) 11:02, 24 May 2014 (UTC)

@Smallbones: Thanks. I'll try and make the time to contribute there. I don't hold anything against the specific people - I see it more of a general governance issue, so that should tie in well. SFB 11:11, 24 May 2014 (UTC)

masterstrack.com

The validity of masterstrack.com is currently being questioned Wikipedia:Reliable sources/Noticeboard#masterstrack.com. An editor is accusing it of being an unreliable source. You have used masterstrack.com as a reference in your editing. I would like to invite your comment. Trackinfo (talk) 00:24, 27 May 2014 (UTC)

Asian Martial Arts Games

Hi, how are you ? I see you merged 2009 Asian Martial Arts Games into Asian Martial Arts Games. I think maybe it's better to keep 2009 Asian Martial Arts Games and merge Asian Martial Arts Games into Asian Indoor and Martial Arts Games, I think it makes more sense. Mohsen1248 (talk) 12:07, 1 June 2014 (UTC)

@Mohsen1248:Hmmmm... I hadn't thought of merging that way, hence why I steamed ahead with merging in the 2009 article. It's definitely another possibility.

I still think it makes most sense to retain an article on Asian Martial Arts Games, rather than merge to the new games. That would mean that there would be no article on the games itself, but we would have many sub-articles on just one edition of that games (which seems backwards in terms of priority). In previous situations, we have left just the main page (e.g. Friendship Games, Western Asiatic Games, GANEFO). That said, 1998 World Youth Games is a similar but unresolved situation as World Youth Games redirects to the year article. A merge should definitely happen with the Asian Martial Arts Games, but I can see the merits of both approaches. SFB 12:29, 1 June 2014 (UTC)

I said that because they actually merged AMAG into Asian Indoor Games. and 2009 Asian Martial Arts Games is now a part of the AIMAG. I agree with you that having both AMAG and 2009 AMAG pages is unnecessary but I just think AMAG page is the one should go. not the 2009 page. we can redirect Asian Martial Arts Games into either AIMAG page or 2009 edition. Mohsen1248 (talk) 12:33, 1 June 2014 (UTC)

@Mohsen1248: I suppose the outcome of the two games merging makes me feel like in reality the Asian Martial Arts Games has been made defunct and the Asian Indoor Games has just changed its name – all of the events at the 2013 Asian Indoor and Martial Arts Games were contested at the 2009 Asian Indoor Games and all the different events that were part of the Martial Arts Games (Karate, Taekwondo) were dropped. Even lots of the literature on the subject still refers to the new games as the Asian Indoor Games. I think if if we were to keep the 2009 page, then it makes most sense to redirect the old games page to the new main games page rather than to the 2009 page (which is logically a sub-article). SFB 12:42, 1 June 2014 (UTC)

I understand your point and you are right about the events but officially they merged these two games as you can see that in the title of the new Games. Asian Indoor and Martial Arts Games even though it sounds like a stupid title and I think they will change it someday. yes I also since it's better to redirect the AMAG page (and also Indoor Games page) to AIMAG page. Mohsen1248 (talk) 12:49, 1 June 2014 (UTC)

and also I have to add, sports are not fixed at all in events like this, they may change the whole program for the next AIMAG in Turkmenistan, probably adding more fighting sports to help the host country. Mohsen1248 (talk) 12:51, 1 June 2014 (UTC)

@Mohsen1248: Okey dokey. I will start to merge to the 2009 AMAG page - I'm sorting through the articles to fall under Category:Sports at multi-sport events, so I will make sure we end up with that edition being just like any other editions of the AIMAG category. I think the Asian Indoor Games situation is slightly different because it has a much larger history. I suppose we could leave that discussion until the martial arts pages are sorted. Cheers! SFB 12:55, 1 June 2014 (UTC)

Thanks, I was checking Asian Games sports and I see only Karate, Taekwondo and Judo never been in AIG or AIMAG events. the rest of AMAG sports were in at least one other edition. I think you can merge them into one category something like Kurash at the Asian Indoor Games or Kurash at the Asian Indoor and Martial Arts Games. Mohsen1248 (talk) 12:59, 1 June 2014 (UTC)

@Mohsen1248: Sounds like a good idea. I would also rather have broader topics covering all these events than lots of small separate categories that do not add much value and only make things harder to navigate. SFB 13:03, 1 June 2014 (UTC)

Copy and paste move: Jodosma

Thanks for your comments; however I note that despite your comments you didn't revert my edits, ergo you must tacitly agree with them. I know we shouldn't do these things but sometimes we have to break the "rules". Incidentally, the photo at the top of this page is not funny. It's not a natural environment for monkeys.Jodosma (talk) 18:18, 10 June 2014 (UTC)

@Jodosma: I didn't revert your edits because, as a non-administrative user, I'm incapable of doing so. Only admins can do page merges. For info, the image above is of the play area of a very large compound for a small number of spider monkeys, and I'm very aware that zoos are not natural environments! SFB 06:37, 12 June 2014 (UTC)

Category:Shooting sports competitions

Category:Shooting sports competitions, which you created, has been nominated for possible deletion, merging, or renaming. If you would like to participate in the discussion, you are invited to add your comments at the category's entry on the Categories for discussion page. Thank you. SFB 18:47, 13 June 2014 (UTC)

En route

Can you please explain why you reverted my edit to 10,000 metres world record progression, when, according to Wiktionary and Oxford, the phrase is not hyphenated? BethNaught (talk) 20:59, 19 June 2014 (UTC)

@BethNaught: Hi Beth! Sorry it was a mistake where I was trying to click edit, but actually pressed "rollback vandal" (my connection was a little laggy! You'll notice that I restored this in the subsequent edit. Sorry! SFB 06:41, 20 June 2014 (UTC)

Sorry, I didn't notice you'd restored it in your bigger edit. Thanks, BethNaught (talk) 07:44, 20 June 2014 (UTC)

WaughTsu

Hi Sillyfolkboy. I have created a page called Tamil Nadu at the Rio Olympics to enable people to easily get the list of olympians from the state of Tamil Nadu, India. Let me know your specific objections to this page. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Waughtsu (talk • contribs) 22:52, 6 August 2016 (UTC)

@Waughtsu: Hello there and welcome! Apologies for removing your new article and redirecting it to the India page. To make sure that Wikipedia has focused articles, there are standards that articles have to meet. In general terms, if you're creating an article then you will need to find sources (e.g. newspapers, periodicals) that directly discuss that topic to support it. While what you added was definitely useful, "Tamil Nadu at the Rio Olympics" isn't really a topic of study in itself. A better way to approach including this information would be to do so in the main India at the 2016 Summer Olympics. You could also start building a list of Olympians from the state on the Sports in Tamil Nadu article.

Again, sorry be being a bit harsh and removing your first edits, but I hope you understand that it was more to do with how you added the material, and not a comment on the value of your edits Let me know if you need any help! Thanks. SFB 00:43, 7 August 2016 (UTC)

Hi Sillyfolkboy. Thanks for taking the time to write a detailed message. I get it now. BTW, do you have concerns, if I create a page called Tamil Nadu at the Olympics and add different sections, covering different olympics, as Sports in Tamil Nadu would be a very broad topic. If you think that is acceptable, could you guide me how to rename the page as such. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Waughtsu (talk • contribs) 04:29, 7 August 2016 (UTC)

@Waughtsu: The same idea would apply, so if you can find sources that directly discuss Tamil Nadu at the Olympics then you can create the article. My gut feeling is that there won't be enough sources to support that. I've noticed there is an article for List of sportspeople from Tamil Nadu which would be perfect for listing the Olympians. You can copy the ones you've added already from here and try to find sources for other people too. Sports Reference is a very useful website – they have compete lists of Olympians by country, India's page is here. Good luck! SFB 09:40, 7 August 2016 (UTC)

Hi Sillyfolkboy. Makes perfect sense. I added the list in the page you suggested. Now, what does it take to remove the page that I created, as it does not take sense to have that page anymore. Thanks for your patience and explanations. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Waughtsu (talk • contribs) 16:39, 7 August 2016 (UTC)

@Waughtsu: Looks like you've found out how to request deletion. This should happen shortly. No rush though as there is no harm in the content SFB 17:36, 7 August 2016 (UTC)

Ewa Gryziecka

Hello, Sillyfolkboy. I've nominated this article of yours for DYK. Could you check ref. #6, please? The link does not seem to work. Thanks. --PFHLai (talk) 12:41, 6 February 2016 (UTC)  Done GTG 7&6=thirteen (☎) 21:50, 6 February 2016 (UTC)

One of the two citations that supports the DYK hook is bad. Odd since you just created the article. Please take a look. 7&6=thirteen (☎) 12:45, 6 February 2016 (UTC)

Footnote 2 is dead, too. It is not link related, but if there is an archive it would be good to fix. 7&6=thirteen (☎) 19:55, 6 February 2016 (UTC)

User talk:7&6=thirteen: Fixed - looks like that one must have changed in the interim! SFB 20:00, 6 February 2016 (UTC)

Thanks. I always check and read every link when doing a review. S*** happens. 7&6=thirteen (☎) 21:44, 6 February 2016 (UTC)

User talk:7&6=thirteen: Thanks for taking the time to review the links for me. It's always nice to know that others value something I've made so don't worry about it all! SFB 23:19, 6 February 2016 (UTC)

I am an admirer, and I try not to just review, but to improve. I was able to put in a helpful citation that gave a new angle to the article, I think. 7&6=thirteen (☎) 02:13, 7 February 2016 (UTC)

User talk:7&6=thirteen: I noticed that after responding and it definitely does help! Sports articles can very easily be written too dryly, particularly stats-crazy sports like athletics, so I always like it when a bit more cultural context is present. I'm also sure that info like this would receive much better coverage if it related to North American men rather than Eastern European women! SFB 02:25, 7 February 2016 (UTC)

Cheromei

Hi Sillyfolkboy. Lydia's brother's life does not belong under Lydia's career. If you want to includ that detail, create a "personal life" section about her life, where she was born etc etc. Perhaps you can move stuff from the intro, such as "She rose to fame at the age of thirteen with a win in the junior race at the ....". Rui ''Gabriel'' Correia (talk) 09:29, 31 March 2016 (UTC)

Hi Rui! I've changed the title of the section to reflect this scope. It's a bit excessive to completely remove an important piece of biographical information due to a simple question of sectioning though. Thanks! SFB 21:09, 31 March 2016 (UTC)

Hi Sillyfolkboy. I am a bit confused with your working methods, especially your use of the revert function. By reverting you are saying that what there was is wrong. If you want to recover what you had added earlier, copy it and paste it in. Reverting is to be used with acaution, as it can be viewd as aggression and unwillingness to collaborate. This often leads to tit-for-tat behaviour, as is the case right now, as I was a bit confused as to what you were aiming to achieve. Also, there are a number of section titles that are almost standard in any type of article and it is good to keep those without mixing, as readers become used and comfortable with seeing a layout that they are familiar with. I will see what I can do. Regards, Rui ''Gabriel'' Correia (talk) 00:58, 1 April 2016 (UTC)

Hi again. Please check what I did. There is more than can be added. This link about brother David says he grew up in eldoret and had to run 10 miles to school. What is the likelihood that the family moved to Eldoret in the neighbouring Uasin Gishu and that they all had to run such a ditance to school? Would be great to be able to find that out for inclusion. Keep well and see you around. Rui ''Gabriel'' Correia (talk) 02:17, 1 April 2016 (UTC)

Thanks

Thanks for reverting my edit. You see, this was the initial edit by user:Hurrygane which I reverted here but was unsure about them. I'm letting you know so that no body would assume me to be a vandal something. My job here is to archive those dead links for the most part.--65.128.133.116 (talk) 21:21, 28 April 2016 (UTC)

That's all cool with me – I tend to use the revert to notify people of my reasoning and start a conversation about the edit, rather than as a criticism. Thanks for getting in touch SFB 21:24, 28 April 2016 (UTC)

Changes to templates Flag*medalist

Hi SFB, I pinged you already at this discussion here, but I just noticed your reply to one of the editors advocating for the change. Do you still feel strongly about this today? I understand you are all about template consistency, which I believe I have covered and would be responsible for this reasonable request that has gained consensus. It is limited only to the 6 "medalist" templates. Please also take a look at Special:Permalink/717651995 that uses a sandboxed update to one of the templates already. Thanks. — Andy W. (talk · contrib) 01:51, 29 April 2016 (UTC)

IAAF ID

Hi! Maybe you would be interested in putting IAAF ID for some athletes? Here I have a list of 2015 WC athletes (OK, bios, which are linked from these pages, so there may be some false positives), which doesn't have IAAF ID at Wikidata. Probably a little bit less work for Rio games. If you want, you can simply copy the ID as I did for first athlete, all input at WD I can do later. I even added Google link for easier work :) --Edgars2007 (talk/contribs) 18:58, 3 May 2016 (UTC)

@Edgars2007: This was a really good idea and it worked well. Took me about 20 mins to do. Almost always the match came up first and the ID can be copied from the url, rather than clicking through. One issue is that searching so quickly in this way for a while causes google to identify you as a robot! When that happened I did the searches one at a time, completing the CAPTCHA and clicking through to the IAAF link, until it stopped thinking I was a robot. This is an approach worth repeating. SFB 23:40, 3 May 2016 (UTC)

I'm glad you liked the idea and thanks for help, I added the IDs at WD. Because of my computer, it would take me pretty much longer time to do that. Yeah, that is very big plus for us, that ID shows up in URL at Google search. And yes, I can give you such lists also for other competitions. I even had idea to put {{IAAF name}} to articles with bot (which doesn't have the link), and also for other sports, but that is another issue. --Edgars2007 (talk/contribs) 05:43, 4 May 2016 (UTC)

@Edgars2007: I think you may find the bot method more problematic. The approach of getting athletes linked from the championships event templates looks very workable so far, so you could start building lists from other championships. Our highest priority athletes are going to be ones who have competed at the World Championships or Olympics (post-1984). To be honest I was surprised that there were still so many missing, given that we've already got over 15000 athletes with IAAF IDs in Wikidata already. Keep me posted! SFB 20:59, 4 May 2016 (UTC)

As Olympics are a lot easier to generate (as we have categories for them), created lists till Sydney. In Beijing list I have excluded all London participants, in Athens - London and Beijing etc. so it won't contain (probably any) dublicates. About 15tk IDs at WD - well, athletics are very popular (has many, many participants) afterall, so I personally am not so surprised. And of course, you are allowed to bring up your WP:ATHLETICS buddies to work, you don't have to do all this alone :) BTW, I did scan frwiki some time ago and there was at least 1000 bios, that have athlete's infobox and doesn't have IAAF ID. Of course, many of them simply won't have. --Edgars2007 (talk/contribs) 21:24, 4 May 2016 (UTC)

2016 Olympics Articles

Hello, SFB. I thought I should let you know about Wikipedia talk:Did you know#2016 Olympics Articles. It seems like your cup of tea. Happy editing! Cheers! --PFHLai (talk) 12:46, 8 May 2016 (UTC)

@PFHLai: I'll definitely be working on new articles around the games so I'll try and keep DYK in mind while I'm at it SFB 22:54, 8 May 2016 (UTC)

Successful regional athletes

Hi. Would you like me to tip you on successful regional athletes with 20+ incoming links when I spot them? If yes, I'll start with one right here: Awatef Ben Hassine (links) If not, I will refrain. Geschichte (talk) 21:14, 29 August 2016 (UTC)

@Geschichte: Hi there! Hope you're doing well . Thanks for the suggestion, I think it's a good idea – I recently tried to build a list for exactly this kind of thing at Wikipedia:WikiProject Athletics/Missing topics and I've been working through them, but it looks like the tool did not find all of the links (Ben Hassine only shows 12). Any ideas? SFB 23:22, 29 August 2016 (UTC)

2016 Asian Junior Athletics Championships

hi please creat 2016 Asian Junior Athletics Championships. http://athleticsasia.org/index.php/results/asian-junior-athletics-championships/68-asian-junior-athletics-championship-2016/file , thanksSwimflower (talk) 11:00, 27 December 2016 (UTC)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2008_Asian_Junior_Athletics_Championships , i add medal table to 2008 and 1986.Swimflower (talk) 12:08, 27 December 2016 (UTC)

@Swimflower: Hi! Thanks for the message. Montell and I have now added all the details for 2016 Asian Junior Athletics Championships. Hope this helps! Thanks for the table. SFB 19:31, 28 December 2016 (UTC)

Holiday Greetings! SFB

	Merry Christmas & Happy New Year!
	Thank you for helping make Wikipedia a better place. Blessings. May we all have peace in the coming year. 7&6=thirteen (☎) 12:46, 27 December 2016 (UTC)

hi dear folkboy

Merry Christmas & Happy New Year. hi dear. pls see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Montell_74 , my friend montell , about vandal and monoply user mohsen1248 and her friends GAB. can u help me? thanks.

I have responded at Wikipedia:Sockpuppet investigations/Rowingasia/Archive. Thanks! SFB 15:05, 31 December 2016 (UTC)

A note about your Olympics note

I thought I would drop you a note regarding your comment at WT:OLY; the wording is far from neutral and potentially breaches the CANVASS guidelines. I invite you to refactor your comments appropriately (specifically the section about "it's leaning delete but you might want to vote keep"). Cheers, Primefac (talk) 15:38, 21 January 2017 (UTC)

@Primefac: I've refactored this to state that this is my own position. Thanks. SFB 15:42, 21 January 2017 (UTC)

Page move (Draft: -> User:)

You probably intended to move this page into the article namespace rather than into the user namespace. 88.113.105.231 (talk) 20:12, 9 February 2017 (UTC)

Oops! My mistake. Thanks for pointing it out! Sorted now. SFB 20:25, 9 February 2017 (UTC)

List of Ugandan records in athletics

Hello Sillyfolkboy. There are permanent changes of formatting of List of Ugandan records in athletics by a special user, f.e. [2] and [3]. I don't know how to stop this edit war in a diplomatic way. How is it possible to protect this side? I also asked an administrator on his talk page and hope it would be helpful. Thanx for your comment.Montell 74 (talk) 05:56, 25 February 2017 (UTC)

@Montell 74: Hi there! Looks like a classic case where discussion for significant changes is needed but an IP user doesn't respond and just persists. You can request the page be semi-protected at Wikipedia:Requests for page protection. Given the time-frames, you should be able to get a week's protection, then we can go from there. Hopefully this will stop the issue and cause the user to engage on the talk page to discuss the changes. Let me know if you have any problems. Thanks! SFB 11:26, 25 February 2017 (UTC)

Results of the XXXX National Games of China

Hello!

Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Weightlifting at the 2013 National Games of China

The outcome of this discussion is inconsistent and unhelpful. Our arguments weren't addressed. Six articles were deleted but the rest of equal nature weren't touched.

Your attempt at notability clarification is going nowhere:

Wikipedia_talk:Notability_(sports)#Championships_for_individual_sports

As a compromise and step forward I'd like to suggest a merging of your athletics and my weightlifting (medalist) tables into corresponding new articles, e.g. Results of the 2013 National Games of China. Subsequently other sports will be added by us and others.

As it stands now the rest of your work and mine is still at deletion risk, decided on a whim by people unfamiliar with the topic. --Wlift84 (talk) 22:40, 16 March 2017 (UTC)

@Wlift84: I'm sorry you've reached a defeatist tone, but it's understandable in the circumstance. The fact my request to merge the info if the articles were to be deleted suggests a disdain for knowledge that is at odds with the project's mission. I found it quite eye-opening that people have such an interest in erasing referenced and plainly factual material such as this. I'm happy to stand up for the athletics pages – after all it is one of the marquee sports of multi-sport events. If you want to proceed with merging to an edition-specific results page then I approve. I would strongly advise the creation of Weightlifting at the National Games of China as well to summarise and list the information you've worked on. I will wholeheartedly back you in those ventures. If those kind of articles start to be challenged, then I would struggle to find reasons to going much further than the ten years I've been contributing to Wikipedia. SFB 23:21, 16 March 2017 (UTC)

What's happened?

Hi Silly :) Please could you tell me what's happened here really I don't understand :) --Kasper2006 (talk) 10:00, 28 May 2017 (UTC)

@Kasper2006: Hi! It looks like the person who nominated the article for deletion has an agenda, as the deletion reason makes no sense. I would be very surprised if this leads to deletion. SFB 11:28, 28 May 2017 (UTC)

That's what I was saying. I warned you, because surely having more experience of me here on Wikipedia, maybe you can remedy it. --Kasper2006 (talk) 09:30, 30 May 2017 (UTC)

@Kasper2006: Your response should be sufficient. Contributors at articles for deletion typically are very dismissive of malformed requests, so I don't think you'll have a problem. Thanks. SFB 21:13, 30 May 2017 (UTC)

Just a request

Hey, would you mind moving the images in the upper right of your page a bit? When I look at a diff, the picture covers up all of the important information regarding the edit in question. Thanks. Primefac (talk) 13:08, 28 May 2017 (UTC)

Italy at the World Championships in Athletics

What do you tell me about this deletion and not this and these others five? --Kasper2006 (talk) 10:39, 6 June 2017 (UTC)

or France at the FIFA World Cup? --Kasper2006 (talk) 10:43, 6 June 2017 (UTC)

@Kasper2006: Hi! I'm not sure what you are referring to. None of these articles are nominated for deletion. In terms of articles, I think there is consensus that the best way to cover this information is at the "Country at Competition" level, rather than a year-by-year summary. I support that and the continued availability of the articles you linked. Thanks. SFB 18:06, 6 June 2017 (UTC)

Magically the article has reappeared :) --Kasper2006 (talk) 08:43, 8 June 2017 (UTC)

2017 asian youth

hi dear, pls creat 2017 Asian Youth Athletics Championships with this source : http://athleticsasia.org/index.php/features/38-2nd-asian-youth-athletics-championship-2017 - thanks.

2017 medal table

Rank	Nation	Gold	Silver	Bronze	Total
1	China	16	9	5	30
2	Chinese Taipei	6	7	2	15
3	India	5	5	4	14
4	South Korea	2	0	4	6
5	Indonesia	2	0	3	5
6	North Korea	2	0	1	3
7	Iraq	2	0	0	2
8	Vietnam	1	5	0	6
9	Malaysia	1	3	1	5
10	Thailand	1	2	2	5
11	Jordan	1	0	0	1
12	Syria	1	0	0	1
13	Japan	0	3	4	7
14	Hong Kong	0	2	3	5
15	Iran	0	1	5	6
16	Uzbekistan	0	1	2	3
17	Sri Lanka	0	1	1	2
18	Kazakhstan	0	1	0	1
19	Yemen	0	1	0	1
20	Oman	0	0	1	1
21	Saudi Arabia	0	0	1	1
Total		40	41	39	120

http://athleticsasia.org/index.php/features/38-2nd-asian-youth-athletics-championship-2017

Bahrain vs. Brunei in Template:FlagATHCH, and presumably related templates

I happened to notice some mix-ups of the flags of these countries at 2017 World Championships in Athletics – Women's 400 metres. The error seems to be caused by the template using ISO 3166-1 country codes (template:getalias (?)) rather than IAAF country codes, which, at least in this case, is the IOC country code (template:country alias). Template:FlagATHCH's documentation currently prescribes use of the IOC codes. As you have the most edits to the template I figured I'd bring this issue to your attention. (I just noticed that the incorrect flags used Template:Flag, however this is because "BHR" was used when Template:FlagATHCH was used. IAAF does use "BRN".) 62.249.160.48 (talk) 21:11, 14 August 2017 (UTC)

Rename/merge categories

Please see my proposal to speedily merge or rename these categories from “athletes” to “people” for these four states, as the subcategories for 17 of the 21 states use “people”, Hugo999 (talk) 05:02, 17 September 2017 (UTC)

• Category:Track and field athletes from Louisiana to Category:Track and field people from Louisiana per C2C.
• Category:Track and field athletes from Pennsylvania to Category:Track and field people from Pennsylvania
• Category:Track and field athletes from West Virginia to Category:Track and field people from West Virginia
• Category:Track and field athletes from Wyoming to Category:Track and field people from Wyoming

The sport is Athletics or Track & Field? The specialization is 100 m + 4x100 m relay or is right Sprinting?

Can I have your opinion here please? --Kasper2006 (talk) 13:23, 25 August 2017 (UTC)

Records

Hi! Just wanted to tell you that I changed the sorting key from Weightlifting to Olympic weightlifting. Also that Category:Filipino records → Category:Philippine records. And also thanks for the help! --Pelmeen10 (talk) 16:11, 23 January 2018 (UTC)

@Pelmeen10: Cool, thanks for that. Wasn't really sure of the naming approach to be honest! Also made me realise that we don't really have a structure for distinguishing "national records" (by people of that nation) vs. "national records" (by people in that nation). Non-human records, like tallest building etc. really drive home that distinction. SFB 23:22, 23 January 2018 (UTC)

hi my dear friend , for past problem i cant , you can , plsease create them , all of results and source prepare now

• https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Asian_Cross_Country_Championships&oldid=801063889

Youth

• 2015 2017

Cross Country

• 1991 1993 1995 1997 1999 2001 2004 2005 2007 2009 2012 2014 2016

also *FISU World University Cross Country Championships was deleted by mistake with abuse me with creator of this article. Requests for resuscitation are required.

thank you so much. best regards

I have requested a review of the athletics related articles in order to restore what is valid material content. Do not take this as condoning of harrassment of fellow editors. Thanks. SFB 14:29, 28 January 2018 (UTC)

thanks

6-1=5 article need to revival (resuscitation)

hi , thanks for create asian atheltics. also we have 5 deleted aticle because of incorrect use of twinkle like to World University Cross Country Championships. 6 article was deleted because of he think created by me , but it is false. all of 6 article was deleted in same time with this : World University Cross Country Championships. only i redirect this articles to correct name :

from FISU to University and from IPC to Para (new name from 2017). but for past problems 6 article (useful and notable and not created by me) was Deleted incorrectly.

from 2017 IPC rename paralympic sports from IPC to Para for example : IPC alpine to Para Alpine

• IPC Nordic Skiing World Championships - now correct name : World Para Nordic Skiing Championships
• IPC Alpine Skiing World Championships - now correct name : World Para Alpine Skiing Championships
• IPC Biathlon and Cross-Country Skiing World Championships - now correct name : World Para Nordic Skiing Championships

• also for Smooth out ALL of WUC from Championships rename to Championship. but 6 great world championship article removed by one of users but not created by banned user.
• World University Cross Country Championships
• World University Squash Championships (my redirect) - World University Squash Championship (main article not created by me)
• World University Orienteering Championships (my redirect) - World University Orienteering Championship (main article not created by me)

revival need(resuscitation). thank you so much.

also all of my edits is correct and he have a personal conflict . in 2015 incorrectly me with other user and keep on over 3 years injusticly. for example see this correct page destroy by he. https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=International_Masters_Games_Association&action=history other destroy article by he : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Contributions/Mohsen1248 other destroy article by 1248 because of Personal hatred: he revert from complete to incomplete: https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=ISSF_European_Shooting_Championships&action=history

pls compare two link :

• https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=ISSF_European_Shooting_Championships&oldid=819972469

• https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=ISSF_European_Shooting_Championships&oldid=819869825

i am sad for this unjustic trand in wiki.

thank you . best regards. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Anafredrish (talk • contribs) 07:24, 9 February 2018 (UTC)

also :2017 Women's European Union Amateur Boxing Championships was created by Marciel (not me) but this name is incorrect. i correct and redirect it to : 2017 Women's European Union Amateur Boxing Championships. but both of two article and refirect page was deleted.

we havent Women's European Union Amateur Boxing Championships in 2017 , we have Women's European Union Amateur Boxing Championships.

• European Amateur Boxing Championships
• European Union Amateur Boxing Championships

https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special:Log/delete&page=2017_Women%27s_European_Amateur_Boxing_Championships

incorrect use of twinkle. thanks again. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Anafredrish (talk • contribs) 07:53, 9 February 2018 (UTC)

@GeneralizationsAreBad: Can you review these deletions? Looks like articles were mass deletion as creations of the user but perhaps were actually copy-paste moves by the user? SFB 18:44, 9 February 2018 (UTC)

Thank you

for cleaning up on categories. I wasn't sure where to start looking. StarM 02:03, 27 February 2018 (UTC)

@Star Mississippi: No problem at all. I know categories can be a bit of a hassle if you don't regular deal with articles of a certain type. I'd noticed that this race was missing an article for some time so thanks for starting it! SFB 02:10, 27 February 2018 (UTC)

Same. After seeing a redlink pop up twice and knowing its fairly significant history I decided to see if I could find enough to stub it. I'll try to dig out some more sources later this week StarM 02:51, 28 February 2018 (UTC)

Duan Qifeng (paralympics) and Duan Qifeng (born 1973) are the same person

I don't know where the "1972" part came from, since I don't see it in the reference ([4]), but the discrepancy may be caused by either East Asian age reckoning, or the fact that January 1973 is within the lunar year corresponding to 1972. Whatever the cause, it's the same person. If you don't object, I'm going to merge the articles together. Timmyshin (talk) 21:21, 4 March 2018 (UTC)

@Timmyshin: I had a long think about this as well and couldn't find where the reference to 1972 birth came from, supposedly from an IPC source. I erred on the side of caution given this stated difference and the fact that I couldn't find any source which quotes that this is the same athlete, or that the previously able-bodied Duan had suffered a vision impairment. I spent about 30-40 mins looking and turned up nothing. The only facts in favour of this are the name and the fact that Paralympian Duan Qifeng seemed to start competing around the time able-bodied Duan Qifeng stopped, and was at a comparable performance level. I'm not against merging the two, but obviously I'll leave you to stick your neck out for any possible blame of adding the info that a living person has become disabled when we have no sources to confirm that SFB 00:37, 5 March 2018 (UTC)

Just noticed you've dug out an interview in Chinese to confirm this. Great work! SFB 00:55, 5 March 2018 (UTC)

Your decision to merge

Why can exists United States at the 2017 World Championships in Athletics and don't United States at the 2018 World Indoor Championships in Athletics? Now, explain it to me like I'm a four-year-old (cit). ;) --Kasper2006 (talk) 08:45, 5 March 2018 (UTC)

@Kasper2006: The United States was completely atypical among the nations at the 2018 IAAF World Indoor Championships in that it sent twice as many athletes as the next largest delegation, thus it's not a good choice for this question. A better approach is to consider the median delegation size at this competition – 84 (74%) of the 114 nations sent only one athlete to the competition. Only ten nations (8%) had delegations of more than ten athletes. These very low numbers mean that (a) you're very unlikely to find sufficient third party coverage that will illustrate that each nation's delegation at the World Indoors was notable in itself, and (b) the numbers are so small that it hinders readability to split information across so many small articles. Readers can comfortably read the results of the vast majority of nations at the IAAF World Indoor Championships on one nation page. (Note that, after the merge, the page for Greece at the IAAF World Indoor Championships is still below 14kb of text, a small article by wiki standards.)

For reference, 46 delegations at the 2017 World Championships in Athletics sent more than 10 athletes to that competition. It's an event over three times as large. Plus, it goes without saying, the quality and coverage of the World Indoors is not remotely comparable with the main World Championships, hence the notability issue.

I'm going to start advocating for the merging of many of the small nation pages at the World Championships too. I don't see any value in keeping South Sudan at the 2017 World Championships in Athletics separate from South Sudan at the 2015 World Championships in Athletics, for example, when South Sudan at the World Championships in Athletics could give a better overview of the same information all at once. It's better that this suggestion comes from someone like me, as it's pretty clear what the outcome would be if a non-sports editor sent these to WP:AFD. SFB 16:59, 5 March 2018 (UTC)

I agree with you, but then the page of those delegations that bring at least 10 athletes to an event could be accepted. After all, merging all the sub-pages on one page would make navigation really heavy. For this reason its could exist (and it is right that its exists), for example United States at the 2018 World Indoor Championships in Athletics or Italy at the 2018 World Indoor Championships in Athletics and not the others with less than 10 athletes. What do you say? :) --Kasper2006 (talk) 18:56, 5 March 2018 (UTC)

@Kasper2006: Yes, I think there is definitely scope for individual articles for the small number of large countries that send large delegations each time. There will almost certainly be enough coverage of, say, the American delegation and its athletes to justify the notability too. It would be impossible to gather the results of every single Chinese athlete at the China at the World Championships in Athletics article. I think a good approach would be to start building information at the "nation at competition" level, then split out into separate articles if the main article is getting around 100kb, for example. That is in line with the suggestions at Wikipedia:Article size. Remember that we can still do redirects to sections, so links like South Sudan at the 2015 World Championships in Athletics could still exist, but they would redirect to South Sudan at the World Championships in Athletics#2015. That keeps the navigation easy and you can also categorise the redirect if you want to show this in the category structure. Thanks. SFB 19:07, 5 March 2018 (UTC)

IAAF templates

Hey, you are removing this {{IAAF Championships}} from outdoor championships only, right? It's pretty good template actually, maybe even leave them there together with the new one? --Pelmeen10 (talk) 21:56, 17 March 2018 (UTC)

@Pelmeen10: Yeah, I've just narrowed it on the World Championships in Athletics articles as part of move towards expanding the championships-specific article set. I've left the rest because they don't have any other articles beside the edition ones.

I've modelled the new template on the French version. The main IAAF template has similarly grown since it's initial beginnings and there is still the Road Relays to do. Hopefully the new template gives a lot more prominence to the events and lists article sets, which were naturally excluded from the IAAF Championships template.

I've no opposition to restoring the large championships template to the main World Championships in Athletics editions, but I'm not sure how often people jump from say, 2009 World Championships in Athletics to 1975 IAAF World Race Walking Cup, and the more templates you add the less attention the existing templates will get. I actually think we'd get higher relevance and searching if we built yearly templates like on Polish Wikipedia, because I can definitely see an interest in people moving from Athletics at the 2016 Summer Olympics to 2016 IAAF World Indoor Championships. SFB 22:32, 17 March 2018 (UTC)

Pay attenction SFB, IAAF Continental Cup is not a world championships (see French and Italian version of the template) ;) ;) --Kasper2006 (talk) 08:00, 18 March 2018 (UTC)

@Kasper2006 and Pelmeen10: That's true! Same goes for the IAAF World Relays. I suppose the real meaning of this template is IAAF World Athletics Series rather than World Championships. On that basis, links to the Olympics could also be included? I'm not sure what the best approach is there. I don't like the idea of excluding the Relays and Continental Cup links from this template, as not a lot of competition content naturally links to them otherwise. That is another problem that a yearly template would solve. I've had a stab at {{2018 in athletics}}. What do you think? SFB 18:49, 18 March 2018 (UTC)

@Sillyfolkboy: I agree that the current template can be left as it is, less on the usefulness of an annual template (too many red links). --Kasper2006 (talk) 07:33, 19 March 2018 (UTC)

@Kasper2006: That situation looks very different when looking at past years though {{2017 in athletics}} SFB 12:11, 29 March 2018 (UTC)

Country alias error

There may have been a problem with some recent edits, see articles with script errors. Currently that is showing a page of errors relating to "World Championships in Athletics" articles. For example, 2007 World Championships in Athletics – Men's 100 metres#Heat 6 shows "Invalid country alias". The following shows two templates from that section. The first works, while the second currently displays the error.

• {{flagATHCHathlete|[[Moussa Camara (Guinean athlete)|Moussa Camara]]|GUI|2007 World}} →  Moussa Camara (GUI)
• {{flagATHCHathlete|[[Odingo Gordon]]|MSR|2007 World}} →  Odingo Gordon (MSR)

I'm hoping you can fix that. Johnuniq (talk) 08:09, 25 March 2018 (UTC)