Talk:UFC 263

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June 13 to 19, 2021

Craig's finish of Hill[edit]

Although the page is locked for now, it is undeniable that Sherdog is the only source that lists Paul Craig's victory as a technical submission. I understand that Wikipedia operates on a verifiability standard, and not "truth". In this case, the burden of sourced evidence heavily leans in favor of listing the win as a TKO. If anything, the "truth" standard would actually support a submission - those of us who watched saw the armbar, saw the dislocation of Hill's elbow, and could likely agree that it should have been a submission; ultimately, available sources collectively support that this was a TKO victory.

I would also like to push back on the description of "sock-puppetry", which is an unfounded and unnecessarily flippant accusation. I can speak for myself that this is my only account. What you are seeing is multiple users who recognized what the verifiable information tells us and attempted to reconcile the Wikipedia article with that conclusion, and did not blindly parrot one source that is prone to subjectivity and error. Savvy10 (talk) 17:28, 16 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]

And barring an actual correction of the method, it is my opinion that the page should at least have a note stating that the result was announced as a TKO. Savvy10 (talk) 17:29, 16 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]

One more note: the results show a technical submission, but the source for the results is the UFC page, which shows a TKO. Either correct the method or find a source that supports your conclusion, but don't provide information and use a source that actually reads something entirely different. Savvy10 (talk) 17:59, 16 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]

The source for the results is not the UFC page, it's Sherdog, which is found at the bottom of the MMA infobox.NEDOCHAN (talk) 15:18, 17 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]

In regard to sockpuppetry, please provide links to such discussions. I can't see any accusations (although blanking talk pages makes it harder).NEDOCHAN (talk) 15:22, 17 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]

The source below the results, which currently shows as reference #18, links to the UFC website. Sherdog does not appear to be referenced there, in the event infobox, or anywhere in the page source. The allegation of sockpuppetry can be found in the revision history of the page. Savvy10 (talk) 22:20, 17 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]

The comment is not an allegation. It refers to confirmed socks and was made by an admin, so it's not speculation. All methods of finish are sourced per Sherdog.NEDOCHAN (talk) 00:13, 18 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I have changed the source so it's a 3rd party and consistent. NEDOCHAN (talk) 00:25, 18 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]

The timing of the comment - immediately after I (not a sock) made the revision - certainly did not help. You can see how it appeared I was being accused of that action. I still believe that relying purely on Sherdog fails the verifiability standard in this instance, but I am at least satisfied that the sourcing is now consistent. Thank you Savvy10 (talk) 16:51, 18 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Update: Sherdog has revised the outcome to a TKO in their Fight Finder; the method here should be adjusted accordingly. Savvy10 (talk) 01:26, 20 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]

next event name change[edit]

Someone with access to edit this page should change the name of Jung Vs. Ige to The Korean Zombie Vs. Ige