Talk:The Inferior

Peadar Ó Guilín was nominated for deletion. The discussion was closed on 01 October 2009 with a consensus to merge. Its contents were merged into The Inferior. The original page is now a redirect to this page. For the contribution history and old versions of the redirected article, please see its history; for its talk page, see here.

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Book Two[edit]

I would love some info on book two, but I can't find any.GrandMattster (talk) 20:47, 18 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Removed Notablity Tag[edit]

I have removed the "not notable" tag from this page. I would be interested in hearing why it was suggested that it was not notable in the first place. GrandMattster (talk) 16:38, 20 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]

It goes the other way - An article needs to show that the subject is notable per either Wikipedia:Notability and/or Wikipedia:Notability (books). See WP:BURDEN which should have been in use for all of the material added to this article. Consult with the Article Wizard if needed. --Marc Kupper|talk 06:12, 17 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I took a stab at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Peadar Ó Guilín. While the author is not notable per I ran across enough coverage of The Inferior that it seems to be notable per WP:BK. --Marc Kupper|talk 08:52, 17 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

The Deserter[edit]

A page was created on "the Deserter", the second novel in this trilogy, and then was deleted because "it was not notable enough" [sic]. Does anyone have any idea why it would not be considered notable? I can't see why it would be, seeing as "the Inferior" got such wonderful reviews and quite a bit of attention. I would much appreciate any advice on how to convince others that the upcoming second book is notable. Thevoiceofreason219 (talk) 17:06, 29 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Why Delete it?[edit]

I do not see the reason behind the proposed deletion of this article. It cites perfectly good sources, and has had many positive reviews. Grand Mattster 20:09, 16 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Critical commentary[edit]

There is no section in this article on the book's reception. Critical commentary is essential to a book's notability. --Bejnar (talk) 18:52, 21 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Notability still questioned[edit]

Its a good book, I liked it. But is it notable for encyclopedic purposes? GrandMattster indicated that Peadar Ó Guilín's book The Inferior is influential and has received substantial reviews. Why is this not shown in the references? The first listed reference is to the author's blog, the second to an interview, the third to Amazon (for The Deserter) and the last to a literary agent's bio of the author. None of these meet the reliable sources criteria required for establishing notability of the book. The first reference (author's blog) is not independent and is only useful for uncontested facts that are best known to the person. The second (personal interview) is not independent and is only useful for uncontested facts that are best known to the person. The third (cite to Amazon) is useful only in that it shows that The Deserter was published, its customer reviews are not subject to significant editorial oversight, and there is nothing significant otherwise about The Inferior, except that The Deserter is its sequel. The last reference (literary agent's bio) is not independent and is only useful for uncontested facts that are best known to the person. DGG mentioned reviews in School Library Journal and Kirkus, why are there no citations to these, paper or electronic? With regard to GrandMattster's use of the word influential, what evidence of this is there from reliable sources? Has a new genre sprung up? Are there news articles about its fandom? Has the book been on any best seller lists? Has the book won or even been nominated for any awards? According to the books' notability guideline cited reviews should contain sufficient critical commentary to allow the article to grow past a simple plot summary. Unfortunately, the quantity of blog reviews such as Adam Whitehead's at The Wertzone and SFF World are not considered reliable sources. The book does not appear, from reliable sources, to meet any of the book criteria 1–5. In passing, I note that the critical comment in the SLJ was in its entirety: This well-paced fantasy/science fiction blend perfectly introduces community conflict at a base level. Stopmouth and his brother are constantly at odds over their roles in the family and their individual ambition. Power and influence are accepted and controlled in very different ways by these main characters and, from the very first chapters, readers can see that lies and deceit are strong forces on the characters. There are numerous situations that could be used to supplement classroom discussion on moral and ethical behavior. Easy to follow and intriguing at every turn, The Inferior will hold readers from page to page, chapter to chapter, to the very end. This does not show that in fact it is used to supplement classroom discussion on moral and ethical behavior. (Criteria 4.) --Bejnar (talk) 18:52, 21 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]

SLJ isa selective reviewing source, listing only books recommended for purchase, a very small number of those that are printed. All its reviews are short. It's the book equivalent of being included in selective encyclopedias. Just add the reviews, and look for others. DGG ( talk ) 19:31, 21 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]

In late 2009 the author's page was up for AFD with the consensus being to merge it into this article. At the time, only The Inferior had been published. At the time, I researched to see if the author was notable but only found evidence that The Inferior probably qualified as notable. I documented my findings on Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion/Peadar_Ó_Guilín and will include a copy here:

Use [show](to the right) to view the full list of potential sources found along with comments. They are sorted in descending usability as a WP:N source for Peadar Ó Guilín.

This page collects four reviews with the latter three being reliable. None of these reviews cover Peadar Ó Guilín.
- Kirkus Reviews (citation not available) 184 word critique blended with summary.
- Foraker, Barbara. "The Inferior.(Young adult review)(Brief article)(Book review)." Library Media Connection 26.7 (April-May 2008): 74(1). . 185 word review that's mostly a summary with some critique.
- Thomarie, Dylan. "O Guilin, Peadar. The Inferior.(Young adult review)(Brief article)(Book review)." School Library Journal 54.9 (Sept 2008): 192(2). 244 word review of The Inferior. The first 113 words of the review body are a summary and the remaining 106 words are a critique.
Audience with the King (more bad than good). The Irish Times (Dublin, Ireland) (Oct 1, 2003): 14. Byline: Belinda McKeon. 174 word critique of the book Audience with the King. There is no coverage of the author. This is decent in that it's a critique and not a summary.
Kunzel, Bonnie . Close Encounters of the Best Kind: The Latest Sci-Fi. School Library Journal (August 1, 2008) available on-line. 62 word summary of The Inferior. No coverage of Peadar Ó Guilín other than mentioning this is his debut novel. (I guess Audience with the King does not count?)
Youngman, Angela. Book Review: The Inferior by Peadar O. Guilin. M&C web site (Dec 5, 2007) available on-line. 182 word review with the first 104 words being summary and then a 78 word critique. Subject of AFD not covered.
Williams, Elaine. Hits and myths. TES Magazine (7 September, 2007) available on-line. 93 word book summary that is a slightly reworded version of the publisher's blurb. Subject of AFD not covered.
Aktuelle Buch-Tipps - ANZEIGE (New book-tips - announcements). Main Post. (February 2, 2009) available on-line. 100 word review in German. Thus is a summary that looks like it's a direct translation of a publisher's blurb. Subject of AFD not covered.
Cottogni, Pino La trilogia delle ossa (The Boneworld Trilogy). www.fantascienza.com available on-line. 452 word blogged review in Italian. One sentence of coverage for the AFD subject. The entire review is a summary with no criticism.
Mabbott, Alastair; Johnstone, Anne. Books also Received this Week. The Herald - Glasgow (UK) (Sep 8, 2007): 18(ABC). abstract on-line. 728 word article but unfortunately the section that covers the book is not included in the abstract. However, the format of this article is one short paragraph per book meaning coverage is likely trivial and may just be from a publisher blurb.
"Tesco boosts DFC sales.(Brief article)." The Bookseller 5360 (Nov 28, 2008): 8(1). 51 word press release that includes Peadar O Guilin as one of the contributors towards a comic book.
I could only find citations for the following articles. All are reviews of The Inferior and so are unlikely to be covering the subject of this AFD in detail.
- Luedtke, Amy. "The Inferior.(Young adult review)(Book review)." Voice of Youth Advocates 31.3 (August 2008): 260(1).
Sawyer, Andy. "The Inferior.(Young adult review)(Book review)." School Librarian 55.4 (Winter 2007): 215(1).
- Spisak, April. "The Inferior.(Young adult review)(Brief article)(Book review)." The Bulletin of the Center for Children's Books 61.11 (July-August 2008): 488(1).

Some of the links are still working meaning they could be used as references to support this article and at the same time show that there was coverage of the story that was independent of the publisher or author. --Marc Kupper|talk 23:11, 21 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Then please do so, or sections of the article, especially opinions, are subject to being deleted as unsupported. --Bejnar (talk) 22:45, 22 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]