Talk:South China Sea Islands/Archive 1

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Archive 1

Three articles to two

We've got three interlocking articles here: South China Sea, South China Sea Islands, and List of islands in the South China Sea. I'm inclined to make them into two, probably by merging the contents of South China Sea Islands into the other two, making sure not to remove any information. Two reasons:

  • Right now, discussion of the contested status of the sea and its islands is split between South China Sea and South China Sea Islands - it would be much clearer if that was discussed in just one place. It's a complicated subject with many details, and will be much more useful for the reader if they don't have to go to two places. The issues of sovereignty over the islands and over the sea itself cannot be separated; claims to the seabed are mostly based on the 200 km EEZs around the little islands themselves. They should be discussed together.
  • Use of the term "South China Sea Islands" is questionable. The groupings of islands that it includes - the Spratleys, Paracels, etc are not universally agreed to constitute a single archipelago; some neighboring countries, perhaps to favor their own territorial claims, don't see all of these little islands as a single archipelago. If the existence of one big archipelago is contested, the neutral thing for us to do is to mention the claim (needs a citation), but not use it unquestioned as the title of an article.

Will there be any objection if I make this change? CDC (talk) 21:22, 28 January 2006 (UTC)

Sinocentrism

This article is too Sinocentric. Several of these islands are disputed territories and have different names in other languages. This article treats the entire South China Sea as China's backyard. DHN 23:17, 1 January 2006 (UTC)

It was a fact that those islands were China's backyard traditionally, before the western colonial powers. Right now Vietnam owns the most part of it not China. --61.30.72.148 02:44, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
This article is extemely Sinocentric. The names from other languages should be included. When I have time, I will try to dig them up if no one else does first. ludahai 魯大海 (talk) 07:39, 30 November 2007 (UTC)

Other problems

There are many problems with this article in addition to the Sinocentrism. I will try to address these problems, but it will take time due to my busy schedule. ludahai 魯大海 (talk) 08:13, 30 November 2007 (UTC)

South China Seas ~ Oil Search, Survey, Drilling Ships and proposals for intrusive developments.

Some few years ago an American Company apparently started searching the disputed area of the South China Sea, or Vietnam's East Sea as the two main claimants, The PRC "Peoples Republic of China" and The SRV "Socialist Republic of Vietnam" variously prefer to name this "disputed Sovereignty area" ~ Wikipedia have Articles on the ongoing disputes of these two main contenders and 3 articles on the subject open sea and numerous islands, atols and reefs therein encompassed.

Unfortunately there appears to be no pages devoted to the oil hungry world corporate, or Government attempts to search that territory for petrochemical sources. Inn view of the ongoing and likely neverending negotiations over sovereignty in an area where PRC, ROC, SRV, Malaysia, Philippines and possibly others claims or even some existing Borders may tend to overlap.

Recently there have again been rumours of conflicting interests attempting to negotiate for search rights, or joint ventures to survey, map, drill or otherwise refer robbygay discussion page if you think such rumor should be debated or set aside in the interest of allowing the countries involved to continue their peaceful border negotiations, and/or joint exploitations for continued regional harmony.--203.99.250.115 (talk) 05:43, 30 January 2009 (UTC)

My view is that you could include in the naming paragraph, comment on other names in common use, EG., Vietnam People and I believe their Government prefer to call it the "East Sea" this being suggestive of Vietnam ownership claim 'East of Vietnam' rateher than PRC claim connotations of the name "South China Sea" as being 'South of China' hence some claim preference to be accepted universally. Notwithstanding that until China siesed Woody Island and some others in 1974, the entire subject area had been Vietnamese Territories and even to day the dispute is ongoing.

Currently on my page ROBBYGAY I am seeking update opinions and comment of rumors that an arguement is brewing, it would be in the interest of World peace to stop such rumor or add substance details if we don't have some magic offering to help settle the potential for oil search commercial interests to cause some sort of unhealthy confrontation. Likewise I think if we seek to foster peace in the region we ought to mention the two names or some other historic name if appropriate. --203.99.251.67 (talk) 01:45, 2 February 2009 (UTC)

In face Wikipedia does give both names and several other names to this area of sea, we can refer to the page "South China Sea" and I believe cross reference and mention of those names on this South China Sea Islands is equally important as ultimately this is a case most likely to come again to the International Court of Justice (the UN responsible ultimate Arbitration as in the case of Pulau bator on the Western Edge of the same sea). That article referred to in Wikipedia states:-

Sunset on the South China Sea off Mui Ne village on the south-east coast of VietnamSouth China Sea is the dominant term used in English for the sea, and the name in most European languages is equivalent, but it is sometimes called by different names in neighboring countries, often reflecting historical claims to hegemony over the sea.

The English name is a result of early European interest in the sea as a route from Europe and South Asia to the trading opportunities of China. In the sixteenth century Portuguese sailors called it the China Sea (Mare da China); later needs to differentiate it from nearby bodies of water led to calling it the South China Sea.[1]

In China, the traditional name for the sea is Southern Sea (南海; Nán Hǎi). In contemporary Chinese publications, it is commonly called South China Sea (南中國海, Nán Zhōnggúo Hǎi), and this name is often used in English-language maps published by China.

In Vietnam, it is called the Eastern Sea (Biển Đông); this name is sometimes used by Vietnamese mapmakers in foreign-language publications.[1]

The part of the South China Sea within Philippine territorial waters is often given the name "Luzon Sea" (Dagat Luzon) in maps published in the country, after the major Philippine island of Luzon. However, the name "South China Sea" (Dagat Timog Tsina) is still the accepted name for the whole sea in the Philippines.

In Southeast Asia, it was once called the Champa Sea or Sea of Cham, after the maritime kingdom that flourished before the sixteenth century.

--Robbygay (talk) 02:24, 4 February 2009 (UTC)

Mao Zedong quote

Apparently, Mao Zedong once said that "(Chiang Kai-shek) is a true patriot" (the original words might have been "蔣先生是重民族大義的人"), when supposedly, Chiang ordered lighthouses on ROC-controlled islands in the South China Sea (such as Taiping Island) lit in order to guide People's Liberation Army Navy ships to their destination to expel a landing force by the Vietnamese navy due to the South China Sea island disputes, during the naval skirmishes in the 1960s. Is anyone able to verify this story by finding a reliable reference? -- 李博杰  | —Talk contribs email 08:32, 14 May 2011 (UTC)

Removed map of disputed matitime borders

I removed the map because not only the information given in the legend did not correspond to the one in the map and the border given where possibly not correct (I compare it wit the one provided by BBC) but give a maritime border for the Spratly Islands that accordingly with the article: "There are no native islanders [...] About 45 islands are occupied by relatively small numbers of military forces from Vietnam, the People's Republic of China, the Republic of China (Taiwan), Malaysia and the Philippines." --Dia^ (talk) 12:33, 5 August 2012 (UTC)

Says there are oil, natural gas reserves

I don't see a citation for this claim. It is a fairly bold statement, and given the current events this information probably should have a citation. 173.32.124.181 (talk) 21:32, 13 September 2012 (UTC)

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Cham

Is the heavily detailed discussion of the Cham position in modern Vietnam relevant to the topic of the South China Sea Islands? It seems more a political diatribe against the government of the Socialist Republic of Vietnam than anything germane to the topic at hand. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.251.28.31 (talk) 00:54, 14 May 2015 (UTC)

I agree. The same sentence is copied and pasted into many articles. This is more related to criticism against the government of Vietnam more than talking about it. Plus, this sentence is repeated in the human rights in Vietnam which is the proper location. Ssbbplayer (talk) 21:58, 2 February 2016 (UTC)

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Indonesia say Natuna Islands are a 272-island archipelago located in the Natuna Sea

The Natuna Islands are a 272-island archipelago of Indonesia, located in the Natuna Sea between Peninsular Malaysia to the west and Borneo to the east. But the Natuna Sea itself is a section of the South China Sea and is not an official international name. Indonesia do not want to be embroiled in rival claims with China so Indonesia say "Ours Natuna Islands are in the Natuna Sea."

Indonesia ratified UNCLOS III and strictly follow the law of the sea. Baselines of Indonesia follows the archipelagic baselines principle provided for under Article 46 of the United Nations Convention on the Law of the Sea. It consists of straight lines linking 195 coordinate points located at the outer edge of the archipelago which serve as basepoints.[1]

On the oposit, China, a well know continental state, had wrongly declared it baseline as archipelagic baselines.

Indonesia was not embroiled in rival claims with China over the South China Sea and has instead seen itself as an "honest broker" in disputes between China and Malaysia, the Philippines, Vietnam and Brunei. Indonesia people do not like treachery. Fisheries minister Susi Pudjiastuti said Indonesia "feels sabotaged" in its efforts to maintain peace in the disputed South China Sea and may bring its latest maritime altercation with China to an international court. [2] Thanto19 (talk) 23:37, 24 May 2016 (UTC)

  1. ^ Online map of Indonesia basepoints available at (United Nations)
  2. ^ Fergus Jensen and Bernadette Christina Munthe (21 March 2016). "Indonesia says it feels peace efforts on South China Sea 'sabotaged'". Jakarta. Reuters.

"Natuna Islands are in the Natuna Sea."--Yes, I agree.
But please note: "The declaration of the Government of the People's Republic of China" stipulates "the territorial waters of the Chinese mainland and its coastal islands to connect the mainland shore and the coastal shore" the territorial waters of the People's Republic of China " ."3 regulations "the territorial sea baseline of the People's Republic of China is delimited by the straight-line baseline method, At present, the baseline of the territorial waters determined by China is linear. "Statement on the baseline of the territorial waters of the People's Republic of China" and "statement on the baseline of territorial waters of the Diaoyu Islands and its subsidiary islands", 92 on the island Reef, on which the Continental coast (including Hainan Island) is 49.48 Straight line baseline; the Xisha Islands 28 base Point, 28 line baseline; the Diaoyu Islands and its subsidiary Islands 17 basis, 17 line baseline, where the Diaoyu Island is 12 base point, 12 straight line baseline, Chek tail Lantau link 5 points, 5 straight line baseline. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 泽璟瑄 (talk • contribs) 09:28, 15 April 2017 (UTC)

claims

"Although China does not control in terms of custody and any rights in any island to date since the United States is pressuring Beijing militarily and many Asian Islands." What does this sentence mean? sheridan (talk) 22:05, 19 August 2017 (UTC)

I have no idea what it means. It was added via this edit by User:212.34.12.9 on 20 June 2017. I have reverted it. Pdfpdf (talk) 05:55, 20 August 2017 (UTC)

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