Talk:Saad Al-Salim Al-Sabah

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Untitled[edit]

So who is Crown Prince now ?Hektor 09:55, 15 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I think Saad has to name one. --Stlemur 10:12, 15 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]
It has been said that Saad Al-Abdullah Al-Salim Al-Sabah is going to succeed. --Ahmed 10:48, 15 January 2006 (UTC
It is also said that Sabah Al-Ahmad Al-Jaber Al-Sabah is likely to become Crown Prince.Hektor 12:01, 15 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]
lol. Why can't they just have "King Dave" or something simple?

Is there support for the "dementia" comment? One-dimensional Tangent (Talk) 02:40, 18 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]

What's its source? --Stlemur 06:55, 18 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Can anyone find a non-Yahoo URL for [1]? --Stlemur 09:17, 19 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Added "Current Event" tag to article. Any thoughts?--zachjones4 19:33, 22 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Go for it. He's due to take his oath of office sometimes this week. -Zer0fighta 20:59, 22 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Oath is scheduled on Tuesday. And the Prime Minister will try to have a vote to have him removed.Hektor 06:10, 23 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Well actually its the parliament that wants Sheikh Sabah to take over due to Sheikh Saad's illness, but the article remains accurate -Zer0fighta 08:33, 23 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Cool --Ahmed 15:27, 23 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Has he actually formally abdicated yet? According to the latest on the BBC, he's only "agreed to abdicate." [2] --Jfruh 00:43, 24 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]
No, not yet. It will be announced in a few hours. I'm keeping my eyes on Kuwait Television and I'll let you guys know once it's official. --Ahmed 02:04, 24 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]
If it is "no not yet" on 24 January UTC, should nt the date of end of reign be modified from 23 to 24 ?Hektor 04:37, 24 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]

So if Sabah Al-Ahmad Al-Jaber Al-Sabah becomes emir, this leaves the interesting question of who will be Crown Prince ... Hektor 02:58, 24 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Yeah, but at least its not a crisis like now, where the country has no head. The Crown prince will probably be someone of the Al-salim branch. Theres somewhat of a policy of alternating the emir and crown prince between the two branches. -Zer0fighta 03:46, 24 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Frustrated[edit]

Ok, its very evident that Sheikh Sabah is going to take over as the next emir, however it has not been declared yet. Its getting quite frustrating. I myself believe that he will take over but at the same time we can't publish information on wikipedia that is not correct. I placed the fact that the successor to Sheikh Saad is "most likely" Sheikh Sabah so I hope that prevents any more false information being poured in. -Zer0fighta 03:53, 24 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]

What happened on the 24th[edit]

Here is what I understand of the events:

  • the Parliament waited for the whole day for the letter of resignation of the emir
  • nothing came
  • then the parliament decided to read the medical report on the health of the emir
  • then they voted to remove the emir
  • then, miracle ! the letter of resignation arrived

So I would like to know what's wrong with: On January 24, 2006, the Kuwaiti parliament voted Saad out of office, marking the first time a ruler from the Gulf’s dynasties has been deposed by constitutional means. The Kuwait Cabinet named Sheikh Sabah al-Ahmad al-Sabah, prime minister, to take over as emir.Hektor 22:38, 24 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The problem is that Sheikh Saad was not "deposed", but abdicated. Yes, the vote did take place, and yes the vote was a success, however that was not the cause of his removal from power. He agreed to abdicate the night before the vote due to pressure from the rest of the family. Keep in mind that the emir has the constitutional power to dissolve parliament should the need arise. Also, Sheikh Sabah was nominated to be emir. He currently does not hold that position. He will most likely take up the position officially within a few days. I appreciate you working hard to keep the pages up-to-date, however it's very easy for a chinese-telephone effect to occur with the wording and interpretation of most news agencies. -Zer0fighta 23:18, 24 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Agreed. --Ahmed 07:16, 25 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Well, call me mean spirited, but I get really the impression that he abdicated only when there was no other option left.
Ailing Kuwaiti Emir Is Ousted (Los Angeles Times)
Kuwait parliament deposes its ailing emir (The Times, London)
Kuwait’s parliament deposes ailing ruler (Financial Times)
Kuwait Votes to Oust Ailing Emir (FOX News)
Koweït : le successeur de l'émir Jaber destitué (Libération, Paris)

Hektor 23:55, 25 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Well of course he was voted out, but you're looking at mass-media headlines here. Of course they're going to exagerate terms to win people's eyes. News is not always accurate. This is from an article from the New York Times: "... the Salem branch of the family, now led by Sheik Sabah, who has been de facto ruler of Kuwait ever since Emir Jaber fell ill in 2000." [3]. It claims that the Al-Salem branch of the family was led by Sheikh Sabah, while he is actually from the Al-Jaber branch along with the late Sheikh Jaber, and it is Sheikh Saad who is a member of the Al-Salem branch. When reading articles such as those online, please have a look at how many advertisements share the page with them, the headlines are exagerated to attract people's attention. Regarding Sheikh Saad's abdication, of course there was little option left for Sheikh Saad, but he announced his abdication due to pressure from members of the Al-Sabah family. He was not "ousted" or "kicked out" like many news headlines have stated. That constitutional law was meant to allow the crown prince to rule the country temporarily or permanently in the event that the emir would fall ill or is unable to rule (once again, either temporarily or permanently). -Zer0fighta 00:22, 26 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Emir assuming power[edit]

When exactely does a person become Emir of Kuwait? With the death/abdiction of his predecessor or with the confirmation of the parliament? It the latter is true, is it correct to state that Saad was the Emir of Kuwait? Gugganij 09:35, 25 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Well theres a lot of details that I am not completely educated with, but basically the emir chooses a crown prince (usually a member of the opposite branch. either al-salim or al-jaber) and as soon as he dies the crown prince gains the position of emir (somewhat similar to president and vice president). There is a constitutional law however that states that should the emir be unfit to rule due to health reasons, parliament has the power to vote the crown prince into the position of emir either temporarily or permanently. In this recent crisis however, Sheikh Saad had never declared a crown prince so there was a bit of a crisis, however since Sheikh Sabah was the former Prime Minister, making him the head of the cabinet, had enormous amounts of power and had already been more-or-less ruling the country since 2003. I don't believe there is a law that that states that he has to assume power but his accomplishments and his position makes him one of the best choices. Had the crown prince been the prime minister (as was the case prior to 2003) when this happened, things may have been far more chaotic, especially with the power struggle between the two branches (both Sheikh Jaber and Sheikh Sabah are from the al-jaber branch while Sheikh Saad is from the al-salem branch). I hope this answers your question. -Zer0fighta 10:11, 25 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you for the information, but I was refering to the exact point in time the crown prince (or whoever) legally becomes the new emir.
Article 60 of the Constitution states:
Before assuming his powers the Amir shall take the following oath at a special sitting of the National Assembly :
"I swear by Almighty God to respect the Constitution and the laws of the State, to defend the liberties, interests and properties of the people and to safeguard the independence and territorial integrity of the Country".
What does it exactely mean? Does the crown prince become emir immediately after the death of his predecessor, but has to wait in order to make use of his constitutional powers till after taking the oath? Or is there something like a sede vacante, meaning there is no emir between the death of an incumbent and the swearing in of a new one at the parliament. Thank you. Gugganij 17:09, 26 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]
I believe it is the former that is true, however I am not an expert in law or the ascension of amirs. (The last time a crown prince assumed power as amir was 1977 which was before I was born). -Zer0fighta 23:00, 26 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Never mind. Anyway, thanks for you answer. Gugganij 23:44, 26 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Sections added[edit]

This is a longish article so I've added sections for clarity - please improve on them. Has anyone got a picture of Saad? -- TinaSparkle 15:22, 14 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Death[edit]

How did we come up with current death time ?Aalsaleh (talk) 22:33, 13 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

What is a heart stroke?76.254.199.144 (talk) 22:52, 16 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Either a stroke or a heart attack. The writer must decide which.

203.184.55.172 (talk) 06:27, 25 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I am sure it was a CIA induced heart attack. When the clear black man rules, the white man is on the scene to do away with him. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.28.89.86 (talk) 06:43, 16 February 2010 (UTC)[reply]

The black man lost the status of his branch because already in 2003 he was too ill to continue as Prime Minister. YOMAL SIDOROFF-BIARMSKII (talk) 10:27, 25 January 2014 (UTC)[reply]

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Slave?[edit]

Was his mother a slave or not? YOMAL SIDOROFF-BIARMSKII (talk) 10:32, 25 January 2014 (UTC)[reply]

She was most likely a concubine. Akmal94 (talk) 04:05, 26 March 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Loss of position[edit]

A sovereign ruler is not "voted out of office". A vote of parliament has no legal effect - it is a mere resolution, not a law.Royalcourtier (talk) 07:31, 16 May 2014 (UTC)[reply]

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