This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page.
I think some effort should be made towards the continuity of this article. The Japanese and English versions, though different, are not so different as to warrant seperate pages. Since the page is on the english site of wikipedia, favor should be to the english version (i.e. Names should be spelled first in english with the Japanese in parenthesis or something else.) Also, the actual powers and descriptions of the demons should be the same across the board (i.e. Zatch should always be lightning, Pamoon/Stars, Brago/Gravity, etc. If info's changed, it should be changed on all descriptions.)Turk Ranma 21:24, 19 August 2005 (UTC)
Also, can anyone track down the idiot who keeps saying mamodos' books were burned in episodes that haven't aired yet? Okay, the mamodo still around are: Zatch, Hyde, Brago, Kanchome, Schneider/Ponygon, Tia, Zeno, Purio, Bari, Ted, Earth, Karudeio, Keys, Momon, Cherish, Biburio, Sooma, and Faudo. I want to know WHO keeps putting in that most of their books were burned!
Also has anyone else notived that there are only 65 mamodo listed although in total there are 100 mamodo sent to earth? The only logical explanation I can think of is these 35 mamodo had their books burned without debuts on the show.
Characters
Under each of the character pictures there is a "see article on ____" space added. If you want to include descriptions on characters (without spoiling it for people) just click on the red link and write away!Turk Ranma 21:24, 19 August 2005 (UTC)
Page Break
Due to space issues, the page needs to be broken up into more sections.Turk Ranma 16:36, 20 August 2005 (UTC)
I always thought it was easier if they where all on the same page. ~ Ultimate Perfect Chaos 02:11, 7 February 2006 (UTC) ~
How? Seriously, what he suggested was more sections, but separating some of the information into a new page would solve a lot of proms. Ace Class Shadow 20:34, 14 April 2006 (UTC)
Characters to merge
I don't know where to put them on the page, so could somebody find the appropriate spot for these characters:
demoruto and robert vile are the anime characters in zatch bell. demoruto's arm blades are used as weapons and to attack. demoruto looks like a demon with wings and arm blades and sholuder armors. he was deafeted by zatch. and his armor upgrade by his final spell
They were in a separate article, which I redirect to this article. Thanks -- Kjkolb 10:15, 11 October 2005 (UTC)
I think all the separate character pages should be merged unless there is so much information like the main characters. Even Zeno (Zeon) should have his page with his partner Dufort (Dufaux). Kolulu and Lori just was shown once and you can just put the paragraph sized summary on the character page. Thank You. - GatoGirl 12345
Images
Sadly, virtually all of the images on this page lack source and copyright information. They need those tags and the approprate description of the source on their image page to avoid being deleted. I'm going to go out on a limb here and guess that the uploader doesn't hold the copyright for them, and that the copyright holder hasn't released them under any free license; so the only tag that could work is fair use. Unfortunately, there's a limit to how many fair use images you're supposed to use in an article, and this goes a bit above that. What it comes down to is that someone is going to have to go over this article, choose a few important images, tag them as fair use and note their source, then remove all the rest. --Aquillion 01:06, 8 November 2005 (UTC)
Another possibility is to create a large grid-style layout of all of them as a single gigantic image (not unlike the way the pokemon charts and wall posters were designed). Sweetfreek 09:21, 25 November 2005 (UTC)
Something else to note about the images, for Purio, he never had any sort of facial hair in the anime. It wasn't even removed for the English dub. I did a cursory image search, and he showed up without the moustache or the goatee. Ryulong 03:41, 14 April 2006 (UTC)
Oh, he did too have facial hair in the anime, just not the anime that's been dubbed in English. Watch the Rein mini-arc and you'll see a very visible moustache. —Preceding unsigned comment added by GoldenGashBell (talk • contribs) 05:10, 1 November 2007 (UTC)
Spells
I realize that this may be a trivial question but exactly at what point did Zatch and Kiyo learn the 5th Spell? Sweetfreek 00:20, 5 March 2006 (UTC)
When They were fighting Zabas and Gallont.Card Destruction Duelist13:51, 28 May 2006
Names
Shin'ichi's dubbed name is Shin. Not Sheen. Here's proof:
Also, I'm pretty sure that Fausuto, Tuvai, and Sooma's names are that and not Fausto, Tsuvai, and Soma. Belgium EO
Ah, sorry about the Sheen thing. The other names, however, take a good understanding of the Japanese phonetic system. Though first, some of the other names, like Mars/Maruss or Zophise/Zofis. Please provide images where their names are spelled as "Mars", "Zophise", "Barry", etc in English in the Japanese anime or manga. If not, then they're just considered as fan names and should not be included, and the default English dubbed names should be used. Mainly because there's no difference between the phonetic pronounciations of their Japanese names and their English name spellings. Now on to the other names that haven't been given English names yet.
ファウスト (phonetically Fausuto) While, yes, the bare phonetic pronounciation of it is "Fausuto" this can easily be reduced down to simply "Faust". In the same way that "Burago" goes down to "Brago" and "Gasshu" goes to "Gash". It has to do with how the "U" sound in Japanese is the "weak" sound. Also, names that end in "to" can be reduced down to just ending in T. Basically, for a final example, my real name "Grant" would be phonetically pronounced "Guranto" in Japanese.
ツヴァイ (phonetically Tsuvai) The first "tsu" character there gives it away. If the name were supposed to be "Tuvai", it would be written トゥヴァイ
カルディオ (phonetically Karudio) Due to the "ru" sound often being used in place of an "l", as there's no L sound in Japanese, the best way to translate this would be as "Kaldio".
ザルチム (phonetically Zaruchimu) Same reasons as stated above, it woudl be best translated as "Zalchim" or "Zalcheem".
キース (phonetically Kiisu) I haven't seen the episode yet, but from what I've heard, his name is written as "Kiees" in episode 146.
エル・シーバス (phonetically Eru Shiibasu) This one's kind of tricky. I got the name "Elle Chivas" from Gashchan's website (the one all the stuff on this page is coming from). It makes more sense than "El Sibasu" since Elle is an actual name and "Sibasu" simply sounds too Japanese to be her. Since she listed "Elle Chivas", either the name appeared that way in the series, or it's a very well thought out translation done by a fan. Either way, it's more accurate-looking and sounding for her. Geg 23:35, 8 March 2006 (UTC)
I can understand most of them, but we ought to give Sooma, Zaruchimu, and Karudeio the BOTD until we hear further. And Sooma/Soma's fifth spell is Gigano Doruk, not Barudo. Begium EO
You're right, I was probably going slightly overboard, but for now, I'm changing Zaruchimu's name to just "Zaruchim" mainly because the "u" on the "mu" sound is very rarely left on. As for Karudeio/Karudio, the correct translation would be Karudio. There's a very small difference. The actual character's name is spelled カルディオ, which is phonetically Karudio. Karudeio, however, would be spelled カルデイオ. Notice the small difference? The smaller ィ before the デ gives it the "di" sound. As for Soma, I can definitely state with certainty that it's not "Sooma" at least in the normal way that name would be pronounced in English. It's name is ソーマ. ソ is the character for the phonetic sound "so" while ス is the character for the sound "su". Sooma would be written スーマ. Go ahead and look it up on Katakana if you need to. Geg 22:05, 9 March 2006 (UTC)
It's possible, but Gashchan may have accidentaly put some wrong katakana on his (her?) website. Elswhere, these mamodo are always referred to as Karudeio, Zaruchimu, and Sooma. These seem to be their official names, and we should probably go with that, and not "best possible translation", until they come to America. Belgium EO
I doubt it. All the other names are very accurate. And just because fans use names doesn't mean it's the most accurate translation, especially when there are big differences between the katakana and the translation (like Tsuvai/Tuvai and Karudio/Karudeio). Geg 23:57, 9 March 2006 (UTC)
Let's use the Japanese names. For all you know, they could become Fausuto, Sooma, etc. in America. Just be patent and wait for them to come over here. then you can change it. EO
For Fausuto, there's a very slim possibility. The "o" may stay, like Kido, but there's no chance the "u" will stay in there. For Sooma, virtually zero, since his Japanese name and the name "Sooma" just don't go together. Oh, and for the other error I noticed, Bazurai should be Bazarai - ブザライ. The ザ is the character for za, not zu. Also, I have been checking them on the Japanese wikipedia site to make sure the names are accurate [1]. And like I said, names like Tsuvai/Tuvai, Karudio/Karudeio, and Soma/Sooma aren't due to different usages of Japanese; they're due to actual mistranslations. Tsuvai's name has "ツ" at the beginning of it, making a "Tsu" sound, not a "Tu" sound; Karudio has a "ディ" in its name, making a "Di" sound, not a "Dei" sound; Soma has a "ソ" making a "So" sound, not a "Su" sound. Geg 00:33, 10 March 2006 (UTC)
Wait, I realized something. Katakana seem to indicate how a word is pronounced. However, words can be spelled differently than they are pronounced. EO
Exactly. Generally, however, words are not spelled differently from how they're pronounced. For example, something pronouced "Buzarai" will not be spelled "Buzurai" and vice versa. Though with Kiees, it's slightly different as his name is written out in English in episode 146. Geg 18:59, 12 March 2006 (UTC)
Pronounciations are not names. Everyone who isn't you considers the names I put down as their names. There are logical explanations for these names:
Tuvai/Tsuvai: You might be right about this one. Howver, it is possible that his name is pronounced with a hard, hissing "t" as in "ptueh" or various other "spitting" sounds that could register as a "tsu".
Karudeio/Karudio: A very minor one. Simply put, "Karudio" is a bare-bones pronounciation as in a dictionary whereas his spelling may well be the nearly identical "Karudeio".
Buzurai/Buzarai: A short "u" sound (as in uuuuuuuuhhh...) can sound exacly like certain pronounciations of the "a" sound.
Sooma/Soma: It is possible for long o's to make a short o sound and vice versca.
So it could go either way. But various places, including kimaera/gashchan, list their names as this. Ciao. EO
But even so, why should that matter? Even if various places do spell them like that, it doesn't change the fact that it was originally translated incorrectly. And yeah, certain spellings can be different from the way they're pronounced, but that doesn't mean you can just change it to whatever you want without proof to back it up. Take Tsuvai for example. There's no proof at all that his name is meant to be spelled "Tuvai", so why change it to that? Is it just because other sites have it listed as their name? That counts as a fan name, and Wikipedia is not the place for that. Geg 23:38, 12 March 2006 (UTC)
Alright. I know when I'm wrong. Let's end this silly edit war. EO
Okay, so we've finally reached an agreement. I guess I have to apologize for getting so strung up over it. One of the things I'm worried about is the dub not going all the way to the end of the series due to content issues (stuff like Momon's underwear fetish will be hard to edit out), so I wanted to get the page as accurate as possible just in case the dub never makes it to those characters. Geg 02:51, 13 March 2006 (UTC)
Oops, I didn't know that was your reason... And hear I thought you were just a wound-too-tight GOI. (Grammar Obsessed Individual) I ought to apologize too. EO
Second names discussion
Well, as it turns out, I am kind of grammar-obsessed, so I did want to make some edits to make the humans' names more believable. Most of these names I got by looking them up on Google. Like I already said, Banikis is a name in some language, I think. I originally changed Kosuna to Cosner, but since "Natsuo" is a Japanese name, a last name like "Cosner" wouldn't make any sense, so I'm just leaving it as Kosuna. The next one was Dipito Koru/Dippit Cole. "Dippito Koru" is the bare bones pronounciation of it and the names don't seem to have any real meaning in real life. Both "Dippit" and "Cole" are real names. Then "Ozi Furaian". Well, since "Ozzy" is the more common spelling of the name, I changed it to that. As for the last name, "Fryan" is also an actual name. Same with "Elle". I'd still like to change "Shibasu/Sibasu" to "Chivas". It makes a lot more sense as well. Also, I just found a site with some Japanese names translated to English. I'm going to look that over and think about what to do with it. Geg 23:09, 16 March 2006 (UTC)
Okay, here's the site I found: http://bd.halfmoon.jp/spell.html. The first line of text at the top reads: "If the background is the color of the sea, it is official. If the color is white, it is due to the original research of the managers [of the site]." Basically, the names in the blue background were somehow confirmed by the show or the creators of the show, I'm guessing. All the others came from original research. I'll go ahead and change the confirmed ones. The only other real notable one is they note beside Jeed/Gide's name that if he's French, the name Gide would fit. Though he looks American based on his appearence. So I doubt he's French. Go ahead and look over them and discuss them if you want. Geg 23:28, 16 March 2006 (UTC)
Ahem, I beleive we had a deal? I wouldn't mess up the mastranlated names if you left the Japanese names as-is. I would appreciate if you did not break promises again. EO
-_- I don't remember making promises. And like I said, I was just trying to make the article more accurate. Geg 23:37, 16 March 2006 (UTC)
But first, a question about the characters in dispute. Someone on the Tv.com forums said Fausuto, Tuvai/Tsuvai, and Torowa were Millennium Mamodos. Should I move them there? EO
Huh... I dunno. It's definitely possible that they are since they came during that saga, but I would have thought we'd know if they were Millennium mamodos or not. So I guess we should just leave them where they are for now. Geg 23:46, 16 March 2006 (UTC)
Rein's bookkeeper: is his name Kairu or Kyle? —Preceding unsigned comment added by GoldenGashBell (talk • contribs) 05:07, 1 November 2007 (UTC)
Main Characters
This is a bold statement, but Wonrei and Kido have been sent back. They are no longer relevant and are no longer main characters. I propose we move them down to "Mamodos and their Bookkeepers" and move Bari, Ted, Earth, Karudeio, Momon and Cherish up to "Main characters" (Possibly Zeno and his surviving followers too, unless you don't want villains up there). Also, Tia and Kanchome should be switched because Kanchome debuted first. EO
I was actually thinking of doing something similar, but not as drastic. I was thinking to just keep the ones we have, but add some others to it. Ted/Jeed and Earth/Elly definitely, and maybe Zeno/Dufort. I don't know about the others, since I haven't seen enough of the more recent episodes to really know how much of a role they play. Wonrei should definitely stay, since he played a large role when he was still around. Though maybe Kido and Dr. Riddles don't really count as main characters. I haven't seen enough of those episodes yet either. And I think the current order is fine, since Tia kind of plays a larger role than Kanchomé. Geg 05:08, 24 March 2006 (UTC)
Wonrei and Kido are main characters since they are in the Bookmark game.
A recent Zatch/Gash Bell video game in Japan features Makoto Raiku (creator of Zatch Bell) as a bookkeeper with Vulcan 300 as his mamodo. Should I add them? EO
Heh, funny. I don't really know, actually. Geg 23:59, 24 March 2006 (UTC)
Why not? I don't see anything wrong with that. Just add something like VIDEO GAME ONLY on top unless you want it deleted in the first 5 minutes.
By the way, WHO THE HECK DELETED THE MAIN CHARACHTERS ENTIRELY FROM THE LIST!?!?!?!?!? They are ceratinly charachters, and I do not see any reason to eclude them. In fact, I see every reason not to exclude them. Now all the people who wrote it originally have to look for the html names of the images and rewrite all the spells. And to whoever did it, it is not necessary to "This spell" in front of every spell description. It's defnitely not fair having to do this all over again.Haku raja 01:52, 20 May 2006 (UTC)
Third names discussion
About the "contact gashchan" thing, that's basically impossible. She doesn't leave her email or anything on that site. I used to post on a forum with her, but that was about a year ago. But anyway, verifiable information is one of the bases of Wikipedia. It's even on the little license thing thing under the edit box. I can't let those other spellings go through without seeing something to back it up, especially when the spelling isn't how the name is correctly romanized as. Geg 23:22, 27 April 2006 (UTC)
Yeek. I am SO sorry. I can't let issues drop, can I? I think it's genetic or something. So, yeah, It's not the name stuff that bugs me, it's the implied fact that you think every ZB fan who spells the names this way is mistaken. They can't ALL be wrong.... can they?... EO
I'd thought about that too, but the only place I've actually seen translations of those characters is gashchan's site. There aren't any manga scanlations out that I know of, and the fansubs haven't made it that far yet. The thing is, most fans of Japanese anime have to rely on the translations on pretty much everything. And when the main source of the translations makes errors, it's going to effect all the fans who depend on that site for its translations. But yeah, I find it hard to believe that there aren't more people than me who noticed those translation errors. We'll just have to see if "everyone" actually does thing the names are spelled "Karudeio", etc when the fansub comes out. Geg 23:54, 27 April 2006 (UTC)
Wenten Shongfen Shonglong Penchom Wenchom Penchom Heirlofure. Bødingyonghwong Paonchom Penchai Poi Noi Garrogee Kaku. Beedur Bodur... Sorry, couldn't resist :) Keysness! But anyway, the question remains... Whose names should be up until the fansubs show their ugly heads? EO
Also, I will shut up about Kaudei/dio/Whateverthehecktherealtranslationis, if Geg will apologise for calling me stupid. EO
I apologize, and admit that it was definitely uncalled for. I went ahead and checked the LiveJournal Konjiki thing you mentioned and looked up the scans of Chatper 244 when Karudio's book gets burned. And I'll admit, it's hard to tell his name is spelled with the "di" (ディ) and not with the "dei" (デイ) in the manga text, so I can see where the main problem comes from. But elsewhere, such as the Gash Bell Wikipedia site, his name is definitely spelled カルディオ as opposed to カルデイオ. But again, I apologize for that. Geg 00:45, 21 June 2006 (UTC)
You know, upon looking at it again, the イ in that picture actually looks too big to be a "di" one and too small to be a "dei" one. Is there a "medium-sized" version of that katakana or something? Anywho, I'll slap the image here "dei" or "di"? until someone who knows more about Japanese than us can determine which it is.
It's definitely the small one. It's just hard to tell by just glancing at it. Geg 01:33, 21 June 2006 (UTC)
Anime vs. Card game
I thought this was interesting, especially after Fein's attacks were named. According to the card game, his attack spells are spelled one way, while according to the anime, it's different. For example, his primary attack is Wigar in the card game but Ugar in the anime. How should this be handled? Geg 23:22, 27 April 2006 (UTC)
Well, you have to understand that in any japanese anime series, there are going to be coflicts between its different story franchises. Take a look at Megaman NT for example: The story diverges incredibly in the anime, manga and game, and there is a charachter with three different root stories. Zatch Bell is no exception. For the card game, lots of things are different, such as mamodo having several spells instead of just 1-6. It's not supposed to link up with the series, its a card game. They can't control what you'll do like in a video game, and there's no real story. They have to make it fun instead of linking. As for your Wigar question, the card game is probably made by a different company than Toei with permission, like Pokemon being directed by an animation company but the card game with Wizards of the Coast. And let's face it- spells can be spelt in many other ways from the show, because the echo produced when saying the spell confuses it. I originally though it was spelt "Ugard." Spells are also different in japanese (Zaker, Zakeru- this explains the lousy English pronounciation of Zakeruga: Zakurga), so that migth be the cause as well. Who can really tell? Haku raja 04:11, 20 May 2006 (UTC)
I'm transcribing these manually from the Japanese versions with my limited knowledge of hiragana. My computer doesn't support Unicode so I'm taking stabs at the lettering based on Wikipedia articles. If any errors jump out at any of you more experienced users (or if you happen to have a manga-based transcription), feel free to correct me. Danny Lilithborne 08:49, 26 May 2006 (UTC)
New spells.
Too many people are adding new spells without providing any source or verification. I can give leeway to mamodo that are featured in video games, but characters that appeared just once will only show so many spells. If you're going to add new spells, please provide in the edit summary some kind of verifiable information about where that spell was used, or it'll get reverted. Danny Lilithborne 07:09, 4 June 2006 (UTC)
A lot of these spells exist in the card and video games, but not the manga or anime. There should be some way of letting the reader know that. Danny Lilithborne 02:03, 11 June 2006 (UTC)
Some clean up
Made a general format clean up (main and nihongo templates, dash format). It doesn't seem I have overwritten anything, but if so, sorry. Also, is it really needed to have headlines like "Someone and Unknown"? If so, all "Unknown" should be changed to "unknown" for the guidelines. Also, I suggest creating a table, or at least float all images to the right to save some space. -- ReyBrujo 20:36, 4 June 2006 (UTC)
Japanese voice actor of Robnos
While researching seiyuu information, I came across a lot of information that said that Mayumi Tanaka was the voice of Robnos, contrary to what this page originally stated (Konami Yoshida). However, Googling both names with "Robnos" results in equal information for either (AnimeNewsNetwork says it's Tanaka, Seiyuu.info says it's Yoshida). Since I am bad at Japanese, and the voices sound similar to me, I am not sure what to make of this. Little help? Danny Lilithborne 08:39, 14 June 2006 (UTC)
This page used to have Mayumi Takana as the voice of Robnos. I only recently noticed it said "Konami Yoshida" as well. The Japanese Wikipedia has it listed as Konami Yoshida as well, but I'm almost positive it also used to have Mayumi Takana. edit: I'll have the answer in a few minutes. Geg 16:11, 14 June 2006 (UTC)
It's Yoshida. I checked the credits of the Japanese episode. Geg 16:37, 14 June 2006 (UTC)
Photobucket links
Are they really necessary? I mean, linking to images about every attack in the series, seeing the amount of characters and attacks, may not be appropriate. I am tempted to add a {{External links}} tag to the article, but will wait some days to see if there is a good reason for keeping them. -- ReyBrujo 23:23, 27 August 2006 (UTC)
Please do so. -- Zanimum 19:57, 29 September 2006 (UTC)
Kid Sonic, don't do this again. Danny Lilithborne 23:42, 25 November 2006 (UTC)
Fine, I'll explain:
1. This article is mostly based on mamodo. Get rid of the minor character link. You should make this article excusively for mamodo.
2. I would for you to put bio info on each mamodo. You guys are leaving out very important info.. You need to post more that just their stats. For example, you have bio info on Faudo, yet you don't have any bio info on more important characters such as Kolulu, Penny, Byonko, and Kido. Same for the millennium mamodo. Stop selling short! Because of this, I'm now lost in the series! Either you do it or i'll have to. Kid Sonic
No you won't. It is not as important as you believe it is. Danny Lilithborne 05:52, 26 November 2006 (UTC)
WHY NOT!!!!!!!!!! All other anime articles have bio info on other characters. Am I the only sane person left on this planet!!!? Kid Sonic
On the contrary, the fact that we don't have an article for everysingle character makes the Zatch Bell pages some of the more saner ones on Wikipedia. Danny Lilithborne 06:41, 26 November 2006 (UTC)
Still, that doesn't matter. If you're going to include info on Faudo, you might as well do the others too(I mean it). And if you don't care about the show or have any interest at all, put someone else in charge. BTW, that doesn't make it saner, that makes it dull, cheap, and limited. Kid Sonic
In your opinion... an opinion that happens to only be shared by bannedusers. Get the picture? Danny Lilithborne 23:08, 26 November 2006 (UTC)
That's really uncool! The fact that you would stoop so low to even say such a thing. It's really sad. I don't what they did, but I just want to add a short summary on eact mamodo(like you did with Faudo) because they don't have articles of their own. Set up a discussion with all the other members(that are ZB fans) an let see what they think. It obvious that you're not a Zatch Bell! fan, so why are you working on this article? Tell me. I'm baffled. Kid Sonic
I actually *am* a fan (check my user page) and it's actions like the ones you're trying to take that keep people seeing Zatch Bell as a "kids show". But let's go with your idea. You set up a straw poll and see what people say. Danny Lilithborne 18:20, 28 November 2006 (UTC)
ive noticed that there used to be the name of who ever burnt a mamodo's book but they have been removed. it used to be beside what anime episode it got burnt at, should it be re-added and left or should there be an extra parameter about who burnt there book?
It shouldn't be there at all. It's just added clutter onto an already cluttered article. Danny Lilithborne 23:54, 31 December 2006 (UTC)
I do not agree. I think it's a very useful information and it's a real pain to check every character article to find out who did it. --Andromeda 15:56, 3 March 2007 (UTC)
Wikipedia's purpose is not to provide plot summaries. What kind of situation is there where one NEEDS to know which fictional character burned a fictional book in a cartoon show? JuJube 00:10, 4 March 2007 (UTC)
Wikipedia has LOTS of plot summaries. Also, for what reasoning, you should also delete the information about when the book is burned. And what kind of situation? Perhaps you don't remember who did? Perhaps you're writing an article and needs the reference? There are lots of situations. --Andromeda 15:02, 4 March 2007 (UTC)
Look, I'm not willing to edit war over this, so how about this compromise? I put all the book burned information on one line so it looks less cluttery. If someone reverts it, we go back here to discuss some more, otherwise, yay. How about that? JuJube 22:28, 4 March 2007 (UTC)
Question
Is it true that there are 6 more demons in the gash bell manga?Shirleybiscuit
I shouldn't really be answering this, but Zeno's letter in the most recent chapter confirmed less than ten. Belgium EO 20:17, 27 January 2007 (UTC)
Extra Spells
Someone deleted the extra spells! I'm using journals to write down the spells of all the mamodo and I used those. Now I can't use them! Someone put them back!
They had spells like Ganzu Gikor (Reycom's 3rd Spell), but they don't have them anymore!
Those spells are from the video games. They never appeared in the manga or anime so it's debated whether to include them at all. JuJube 22:38, 10 February 2007 (UTC)
You could still put them, they were really believable! Besides, if they were in a video game or card game, which is creatd by the same people who write the manga and anime, they should be real.
That's not necessarily true. Also, I'm not the one who removed them. JuJube 01:24, 26 February 2007 (UTC)
You do have a point, but they still could work! And if I'm not mistaken, you have video-game exclusive mamodo on this article or whatever it's called.
For all those adding to the Character List Purio has no spell close to Jyboido. His spell is Dioga Joiboido explained in chapter 297 so do not add anything. User:UruZakerga101
since there are anime only demons, im guessing there must be manga only demons aswell to make it to a 100 right? does anyone know who they are? Letuce 08:03, 15 March 2007 (UTC)
Gomu and Clear Note are only in the manga, for starters. JuJube 23:21, 15 March 2007 (UTC)
There's also Ashuron and Rin Viz. I'm sorry, but the link to my userpage isn't working. I'm sort of new here, and I'm not sure if this is my fault or not. Anyway, here's the link if anyone can please fix it or tell me how. GoldenGashBell
Cruft
Er, I know this is an old discussion, but I would consider short summaries of the characters' roles infinitely more encyclopedic than spell lists for each character. For instance: If not for Zatch's character page, all we would have about him are his spells. I mean, it's nice to know he can shoot electricity and summon lightning dragons, but it would be more meaningful to know about his role and personality.
For an example that actually exists: If I knew nothing at all about the series and came to Wikipedia for information, what would I know about Dr. Riddles and Kiddo. Essentially, their spells and nothing more. There are only two sentences that directly mention Dr. Riddles calling on mamodo to ally against Zofis (neither of which are on Zatch's, Brago's nor Zofis' pages, where it matters; rather, they are on Wonrei's and Ponygon's, of all places). Wouldn't you agree that it is more meaningful that Riddles lead the team to Zofis than it is that Kiddo can make miniature duplicates of himself with enhanced strength?
In fact, I might go so far to say that a complete spell list of every single mamodo in the series, however much I use it for reference, is cruft. A description of the character's attribute (Penny uses water attacks; Kiddo uses artillery; etc) should suffice. Now, I'm not complaining about the Ninjutsu (Naruto) articles, despite it being a bigger attack list than this one. That's because proportionally, there is more information about Naruto's plot, characters, and real world relevance such that the eight or so articles on attacks are miniscule in comparison. Likewise, I might have considered the Enemies in The Legend of Zelda series to be cruft, and I still might. But looking at all of the other articles relating to the series, the Enemies article doesn't seem too bad proportionally. What I'm trying to get across is this: If you want to have a huge list of relatively unimportant information, you need to get the more important information in first. You Can't See Me! 04:32, 6 April 2007 (UTC)
I actually nominated the article for AfD once based on this idea, but it didn't take. Also, the reason I don't hink Dr. Riddles and Kido merit a page is because Kido doesn't even last an entire story arc and Dr. Riddles' role afterwards is pretty minor. JuJube 08:14, 6 April 2007 (UTC)
Page? That's not quite what I meant. What I mean is, rather than focusing entirely on attacks, a sentence or two noting the mamodo's role ought to go under that mamodo's section since that is (usually) more important than their spells.
As for Kido and Dr. Riddles, despite the fact that the former did not survive the entire arc, I think that they pretty much drove that story arc. I mean, they did get the team together, find Zofis' location (albeit withholding that information from Kiyo initially), and teach the main characters a few things about Mamodo. At the very least, they're as notable as Wonrei.
I think I have an idea, though... Rather than create a new pages for Kido and Doctor Riddles, Gustav and Bari, and other major recurring mamodo, how about one single new article, Major mamodo in Zatch Bell or something to that effect. Major recurring (or otherwise important) characters, such as the aforementioned Kido and Bari, as well as Purio, Penny, Rops (mainly due to Apollo's contributions), Kolulu (to a lesser extent), and others can go on with relatively longer descriptions. Thoughts You Can't See Me! 08:50, 6 April 2007 (UTC)
It doesn't seem like a bad idea to me; I'm just not entirely sure how to go about it, especially judging who's notable and who's not. Is Purio a more notable character than Kolulu? Even though the latter only appeared in one episode she seems much more important to the thrust of the series than... you know, that mustache guy. JuJube 08:57, 6 April 2007 (UTC)
I think whoever is key to the story is dependant on what is brought to it. Papipulio really isn't the best example since he actually has survived all the way to the "final ten"...but of the minor Mamono, Colulu is probably one of the big ones compared to ones like Kiclops or Donpoccho..heck even some of the more notable adversaries early on and some of the allies like Yopopo and Danny don't do as much to the story as Colulu did. -StrangerAtaru 00:20, 3 July 2007 (UTC)
It's a good idea! I'll get started on it right away!
Out of the characters with articles, only Zofis has been shown to be able to fly. (Kanchomé has transformed into a glider, but that's not the same, and he doesn't get the abilities of whatever he transforms to, so he can't fly.) There are other characters in this article that are heavily featured as fliers, such as Ashuron. JuJube 21:12, 25 April 2007 (UTC)
I added Zofis to the category like so: [[Category:Anime and manga characters who can fly|Zofis]]. Thank you. ~I'm anonymous
Technically besides Zophis (who has a Frieza action behind his flight), some other Mamono can fly too. Off the top of my head, Zavas, Bago (well he has the wings), Ashuron, Elzador...and possibly Jedun are also fliers. Almost thought Fein too but he's just wind manipuation. -StrangerAtaru 00:18, 3 July 2007 (UTC)
The manga has shown that Ponygon can fly too. Just a reminder. (the artist formerly known as JuJube) 71.110.2.111 08:09, 7 September 2007 (UTC)
Fair use problem
I think we might have a real fair use problem with this article and Ancient Mamodo. Crap. JuJube 08:42, 1 May 2007 (UTC)
Oh, you mean that it was copypasta'd from Gashchan? Yes, sorry, most of that was me, when I was new. So it is I who shall fix it. AWAY! Belgium EO 21:54, 28 June 2007 (UTC)
Gaporuk
-Does Kanchome actually use it in the manga? I know he uses it in the games but not in the manga, right? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 69.114.110.8 (talk) 23:58, 8 May 2007 (UTC).
I WANT TO KNOW WHOS POSTING RANDOM SPAM IN THE ARTICLES
STOP SPAMMING
question
How come on the wikipedia there are 65 mamodos listed from the manga when there is suppose to be 100 mamodos listed from the manga?
I think it's because there weren't actually 100 mamodo in the show or manga to begin with. Maybe they had an idea for all 100, but couldn't quite fit them all in? They were really stretching it with mamodo like Donpoccho and Elzador/Eruzadoru... GoldenGashBell
If you count a lot of the flashbacks there are probably around 80 or maybe 90. Like the flash backs with Brago and Wonrei,those are several. But I agree with GoldenGash, they probably just couldn't fit them all. Jason Garrick 18:29, 24 August 2007 (UTC)
Semi Protect this page?
I've noticed that many random users without registered accounts have been adding uncited (and more than likely incorrect) information to this article. I think the page should apply for semi-protection. Thoughts? -XxKibaxXTalk 17:19, 5 August 2007 (UTC)
I'm sorry about something, first of all. I added a spell to Zatch's page called Gebaru Rashirudo, but I know found out that it is a fake. I'll delete it and such. But I need to say something else about the unregistered users! They're editing the color of the spellbooks! I'm sorry, this may seem like a really minor thing, but it burns me up! Colors like "Chatruse Yellow" and "Charcol Gray" means they can't even spell right! It's just annoying, so if somebody can, please block them. GoldenGashBell
This is me talking from my sister's laptop. Me and my family are on vacation to Boston, so I'm not on my normal computer. Somebody is changing the color of Gomu's spellbook to "Ebony" and I would like it to stop. I've also noticed that the color of Ashuron's book is now "Baboon-Red", which isn't even a color to begin with! I'm going to try to change Ebony back into Gray and Baboon-Red back into Light Gray. GoldenGashBell
You're not understanding that those colors have been confirmed by the writer, and the colors are listed on Shonen Sunday's website. The editor has been constantly stating this. Also, if memory serves, you have been changing Ashuron's book color to Cerulean without reference. You're on thin ice in my book, and I have a mind to report you for introducing uncited and incorrect information to this article. In addition, if you revert my revert, then I will report you unless you have verification, contrary to breaking the three-revert rule. -XxKibaxXTalk 19:32, 13 August 2007 (UTC)
If these colors have been "confirmed" (and I do apologize for the previous "Cerulean" thing) by the writer, why have the colors been changed again? I certainly didn't do this. GoldenGashBell 24:30, 5 October 2007
To Uī Mū Uō, or not to Uī Mū Uō?
While I'm at it, I should question this honestly, as I'm not sure... Should Uī Mū Uō really be listed at the beginning of the spell name? Mir doesn't read it that way, but does read those words when controlling the spell. Maybe Uī Mū Uō should be put in parenthesis? -XxKibaxXTalk 19:41, 13 August 2007 (UTC)
Pictures and video game spells
-What happened to the pictures for each of the mamodos. I understand if you don't post it for spells but couldn't we leave the mamodo pictures there? Also, can we list the spells from the video games and card game along with labeling that they are not canon spells? Jason Garrick 05:47, 2 September 2007 (UTC)
The spell pictures were taken off because there were just too many, the article was tagged for it before and action was taken. The pictures of all of the mamodo violated the fair use rules. The video game spells aren't listed because we have little to no way to verify them all. You should really be checking the rest of the talk page before asking questions, and when posting a new topic on a talk page, use that + mark thing next to the edit page tab. It makes it better organized. -XxKibaxXTalk 12:34, 2 September 2007 (UTC)
On Brago and list order
With the Zatch Bell manga winding down to its conclusion, a thought occured to me of something that could seriously confuse people while reading this list. This thought is the fact that Brago stands a very good chance of winning. What does this have to do with our list? Well, we have always had Zatch listed first, which makes sense, as he is the main character and appeared first. But, we also have the king festival Mamodo sorted in order of their place. So, let's imagine that the manga ends with a victory for Brago. How do we order Brago and Zatch? If we follow the order for the king festival list, if Brago wins, we should list him first. That, however, may make people wonder why the main character is not listed first. If we place Zatch first but rank him second, well, that would make even less sense. Thoughts? Belgium EO 06:05, 30 September 2007 (UTC)
I think maybe after the King Festival ends, we should just rearrange the Mamono back in order of manga introduction with mention of making the King Festival. Thus Brago would be back to where he was introduced. (between Godufre & Sugina -StrangerAtaru 01:06, 20 October 2007 (UTC)
STOP CHANGING THE PAGE
Please whoever is changing the page, and taking away the spells of the mamodo stop. Jason Garrick 21:27, 22 October 2007 (UTC)
Why are you encouraging people to leave fancruft? JuJube 21:29, 22 October 2007 (UTC)
I can't believe the spells are even considered fancruft. The spells are what make up the show!! Jason Garrick 21:32, 22 October 2007 (UTC)
Funny, I thought it was the characters and writing. JuJube 21:37, 22 October 2007 (UTC)
Ah... the annoyance of wikipedia editing. w/e. do what you please. I have another web site anyway. And for the record, the essential plotline is that when the two partners work together and overcome and block of adversity, a new spell is unlocked. Hm, well what is that spell? Well now we don't know. Jason Garrick 21:50, 22 October 2007 (UTC)
There are plenty of fansites where you can get that information from. Also, you're not 100% correct about the circumstances under which a new spell is unlocked, but that would be delving into a fandom discussion that has nothing to do with improving this article. JuJube 21:53, 22 October 2007 (UTC)
To tell you the truth, the spells don't really add much to this page. Sure, it'd be nice to know what the name of Danny's self-healing spell is, or which spell is Rein's strongest, but it's not a necessity. Golden Gash Bell 24:01, 1 November 2007 (UTC)
There's kind of a link in the reference section, that goes to a site that has the spells, and only the spells, so don't complain, and go to that site if you only care about the spells —Preceding unsigned comment added by Masten 22 (talk • contribs) 23:56, 31 October 2007 (UTC)
Book Color
Should we be mentioning the book colors?
It's not exactly important information. I do feel sympathy for poor Zatch, however, because his book color is commonly mentioned in the series and stuff. -XxKibaxXTalk 12:23, 18 November 2007 (UTC)
Page transformation left unfinished
From Eruzadoru and Abiira Sabiira and down still remains the old list of spells and basic information (first appearance voice actors etc etc). A project was started on this page to provide decent character summaries for each character but that seems to have been stopped. Does anyone with knowledge of the Faudo and Clear Note arcs want to finish it? -XxKibaxXTalk 13:30, 18 May 2008 (UTC)
Proposal: Merge List of Ancient Mamodo to here
Most of the characters listed on List of Ancient Mamodo are hardly notable, save for a few which are very important to the plot. The important characters should be put into the Ancient Mamodo heading on this page. The rest really don't need to be listed. -XxKibaxXTalk 13:50, 18 May 2008 (UTC)
Fanmade Mamodo?
In the caption of the picture at the top of the page it says there are fanmade mamodo in the picture. How is that? Was there some kind of contest?--LoganTheGeshrat (talk) 19:32, 8 September 2008 (UTC)
I believe so, although I don't know the details. JuJube (talk) 00:03, 9 September 2008 (UTC)
Merge proposal
I disagree with the merge proposal and think this page ought to be renamed to something like "List of mamodo and bookkeeper teams in Zatch Bell!". JuJube (talk) 06:50, 13 December 2008 (UTC)
Minor characters are by themselves not WP:N unless you can find real-world evidence beyond merchandise or 1 review that shows that despite being a minor characters, they had massive impact. That said, I do not think that this is an AfD as there may be important information here for someone to understand the series.じんない 01:09, 14 December 2008 (UTC)
I suggest a very selective merge of the minor characters list, but we should first pair down the information there to what is essential so we don't end up moving a bunch of fancruft into the main list article. --Kraftlos(Talk | Contrib) 23:00, 27 January 2009 (UTC)
Well the easiest way to start is by removing characters who probably only have 1 line (beyond their voice actor) as if they don't even have that much in-universe info there is unlikely any significant real-world info on them.じんない 22:53, 3 February 2009 (UTC)
I agree with Jujube Solar Flute (talk) —Preceding undated comment added 07:52, 18 April 2009 (UTC).
Keep in mind that this isn't a democracy. Could you please elaborate on how such a list could meet the required guidelines for independent coverage? --Kraftlos(Talk | Contrib)
The minor list has been redirected here. Feel free to finish merging any of the minor characters here that are more supportive than minor. -- AnmaFinotera (talk·contribs) 14:03, 11 June 2009 (UTC)
Oppose I'm against a merge, since there isn't any information likely to be merged, it just a delete/redirect. Are there any characters you believe belong over here? I think all the major ones are already here, so no reason to copy over the minor ones. DreamFocus 14:11, 11 June 2009 (UTC)
You oppising months later does not change the consensus above. If any minor ones should be noted here, they can be merged on an individual basis as the editors were notified. Please stop being disruptive just because you think Wikipedia should be a big fansite. -- AnmaFinotera (talk·contribs) 14:16, 11 June 2009 (UTC)
2 against, one for, and the other not saying one way or the other. There was no consensus for a merge. DreamFocus 14:56, 11 June 2009 (UTC)
Question Are any of the characters on the minor list reoccurring characters or are they incidental one-shots whose purpose is to be obstacles for the protagonists? --Farix (Talk) 14:32, 11 June 2009 (UTC)
After looking through the article, I have to say that almost all of these characters are incidental. So a merge is very much called for. Most of these characters generally no more important than the villain-of-the-week if not less so. Naomi is the most significant character on the whole list, and that is only because she repeatedly bullies the main character, but its not much in the grand scheme of things and especially considering the large cast this series has. --Farix (Talk) 02:48, 12 June 2009 (UTC)
After merge
I brought over Naomi's character as reading it, and what little I know about the series, Naomi appears to be the only minor character who might have some importance. Per WP:PRESERVE I think its appropriate. The rest are either 1-2 epiodes/chapters or are entirely background characters of no significance.陣内Jinnai 16:43, 11 June 2009 (UTC)
Oh right, her. She appears every so often so I guess she's notable.DragonZero (talk) 22:20, 11 June 2009 (UTC)
Humans and Mamodos Or Mamodos and Humans?
What should the order be. For one, Kiyo is more of a major character than Zatch by a tiny bit in my opinion so he must be first before Zatch. DragonZero (talk) 02:21, 28 August 2009 (UTC)
It shall be Humans and Mamodo's now, seeing as the Human characters generally have more depth. DragonZero (talk·contribs) 10:13, 28 July 2010 (UTC)
I believe the pairs are most commonly referred to as "mamodo and partner" in the manga, so perhaps it should be "Mamodos and Humans"--LoganTheGeshrat (talk) 02:24, 29 July 2010 (UTC)
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