Talk:Joseph Fouché

Untitled

All told, this article on Joseph Fouché is balanced and well-written. The author makes a case that Fouché was something of a political mercenary, selling his cunning out to those with the greatest capacity to further his personal gain; the overall message being that Fouché was both brilliant, incredibly opportunistic, and not insignificantly morally bankrupt. The author assumes that Fouché had no well-founded beliefs himself, and was instead virtually void of true political attachment. This is an oversimplification, as, more likely, Fouché was simply a product of a kind of Realpolitik that such turbulent times make necessary. The author states that it was not until 1794 that Fouché became truly cunning. No coincidence, one would think, that this coincided with the death of Maximilien Robespierre, with whom Fouché had associated since his time in Arras. Fouché’s more fluid political positioning from this point forward is quite understandable when placed in such context: better to be behind the Guillotine than below it. As such, to claim that Fouché was essentially a cunning and ruthless egotist is most likely a mischaracterization of a man who, more likely, was a brilliant politician who, while not being without convictions, was more inclined to stay alive and maintain his grip on the nexus of power than fade into oblivion or, perhaps just as likely, lose his head. Nonetheless, the article makes several very valid points and arguments. That Fouché was, indeed, a shrewd politician with an unrivaled zeal and talent for self-preservation and advancement is quite well described and supported. His ability to rebound in Napoleon’s favors, even after seemingly catastrophic turns of events, are a great testament to his abilities. His capacity to simultaneously serve Napoleon and initiate contacts with Metternich, just in case, illustrates his propensity for both secrecy and shrewdness. An even more telling example of this same talent is illustrated in his ability to work publicly for the recognition of Napoleon II while simultaneously assuring the elevation of Louis XVIII. His further ability to secure a place for himself in Louis’ ministry, though short lived, having been a radical Jacobin who voted for the Regicide, is a true testament to his skill. The article is well supported in textual sources. The pamphlets authored by Fouché himself no doubt shed a great deal of insight into the man’s public face and his intelligence while simultaneously casting a light on his political positioning on the most public scale. Also cited are numerous volumes on Fouché himself, as well as the intrigues, plots, and offices to which he was party. The author also includes helpful notes regarding the shortcomings and strengths of some of these volumes. In summation, this article is a well-documented examination of Fouché’s life and talent. The only area which is somewhat lacking is in his personal life. Perhaps information on his personal relationships with various individuals, his love life, and the attitudes of the man himself would shed further light on his public face and humanize this manipulative politician.

That is one of the Problems with the figure of Joseph Fouché, 50 years after the casualties would rot from the ground from Napoleon's despotic and unexplainable late wars, the interest in Napoleon as a genious for his time grew large and without meassure, and thus, the judas of the story, Joseph Fouché, recieved a rather vile treatment for a man who didnt do anything what his contemporaries would had not done at the time, Fouché was quicker perhaps, smarter indeed. Oportunist?, a much too small of an adjetive for a man who re-made the word oportunism. Fouché, although not the best of the men, saved many lives from the despots of the time, but always to save his own life in the process, all his actions had a meticulous political motive behind it, he probaly saved as many as the "Mitrailleur de Lyon" once executed, a title that would not leave him. From being the first true "communist" in history to then end his days as the wealthy duc d'Otrante, Fouché's story is probably one of the most interesting and less talked about historic figures of our times.

There is a contradiction between this page and the Louis-Antoine-Henri de Bourbon-Condé, duc d'Enghien page. According to that page, it was Talleyrand who said "It was worse than a crime; it was a mistake", while this page explicitly claims it was Fouche. I don't know which is correct but someone should probably figure it out.

Rhinocero 07:38, 21 February 2007 (UTC)

Better portrait removed?

This article was not long ago illustrated with one more portrait. If I remember it correctly it did not depict him as handsome as the other portraits used as illustrations. I strongly suspect that it has more likeness to him than the other portraits of him I have seen. Can anyone tell me where this picture is? I have searched all versions of this article in other languages as well as Wikimedia Commons without finding it.

2010-07-29 Lena Synnerholm, Märsta, Sweden.

Infobox - "error"

Joseph Fouché is mainly known to have been France's head of police, and he is by not so few historians recognized as the first ever police officer who knew how to gather intelligence and use it. I also believe that thanks to his work, First Council Bonaparte's (later Emperor Napoleon) life was saved at an assassination attempt. (The latter part comes from the French TV-series "Napoleon" from the mid zeroes; Fouché was also the one who "fired" Napoleon after Waterloo, according to the same TV-series) In any case I think the infobox should put the police officer role at top, whatever office he might have held during a few weeks after Waterloo. Boeing720 (talk) 20:22, 16 November 2017 (UTC)

Strange phrasing

Introduction rather makes it sound as though First Consul Napoleon Bonaparte and the Emperor Napoleon were different people! 86.176.6.136 (talk) 22:37, 15 February 2024 (UTC)