Talk:I've Never Met a Nice South African

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Songs

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This article was nominated for merging with Spitting Image on 6 September 2014. The result of the discussion was no consensus.

82.13.28.123 wrote (since rv'd): The BBC has not yet apologised from broadcasting this racist and stereotyping sketch, yet they apolgised when the name of a certain type of Muslims was prounounced wrong. Needless to say it can be deeply offensive to White South Africans.

You make a good point that should have been better expressed without the dig at the Beeb. In any case you'll be waiting for eternity for the BBC to apologise about Spitting Image. It was an ITV production! BaseTurnComplete 18:31, 24 March 2007 (UTC)[reply]

And lets not forget "stingingly accurate". Apologise for taking pot shots at an autocratic regime? That'd be like them apologising for what they did to Saddam, Reagan or whoever else they attacked in their time.--Koncorde 23:09, 15 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]

They didn't mainly do that - they insulted South Africans. Would it be OK to insult Chinese people savagely just because of theirs, or the far worse behaviour with respect to race in, e.g. much of the US in the last century? Secondly, I notice that there's some inherent racism to the song itself - did Black South Africans not count as South Africans? Or were the writers agreeing with the oppressive Apartheid government in denying them their right to be considered as such? Never mind the many nice White South Africans - do Tutu and Mandela count? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 41.185.102.90 (talk) 18:32, 13 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I'd love to see a South Korean version, they publish this "black book" there naming everybody, and the descendants of everybody, who may have possibly helped the Japanese in any way during World War 2. I mean, condemning the great-grandchildren of people decades later? That's savage, barbaric, "blood feud" behaviour! You see that sort of thing from cave-dwelling Afghan tribesmen. And the British. 81.135.97.75 (talk) 20:07, 29 October 2012 (UTC)[reply]

"Sung by Andy Roberts", wasn't it sung by Chris Barrie? Shaun680 22:56, 14 October 2007 (UTC)[reply]

haha this is brilliant--129.215.149.98 15:16, 18 October 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Why don't they ban this song as racist? They would do if it were about black South Africans (I have quite strong views on things like this because my aunt was a white South African) --User:GeorgeFormby1 —Preceding comment was added at 16:48, 6 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I think you've missed the point... This was an attack on Apartheid era South Africa, a state where racism was enshrined in the law. The lyrics are actually anti-racist rather than racist, the main critisism of the white South Africans is that they are "racists", that they are "murderers" and that they "smell like baboons". The first two were valid political opinions at the time and the third is clearly supposed to be satirical.86.149.214.15 (talk) 17:28, 26 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

The verses were sung by Andy Roberts. The choruses were sung by Mark Stevens and other members of band, including Peter Brewis, the song's composer, whose inane laugh is heard at the end of the 'no sense of humour' line.Wes Pacek (talk) 16:01, 13 July 2008 (UTC)[reply]

There's a line in the song "I've had sunstroke in the Arctic" which someone keeps changing to "sunshine in the Arctic". If you listen to the song on YouTube you can hear it really does say "sunstroke" as sunshine isn't an unusual thing in the Arctic. I think there's a website on which the lyrics are given as "sunshine" but this is clearly a mis-hearing. Spaced1999 (talk) 17:09, 11 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Look the video up on youtube and count the number of white South Africans who find the video amusing and those who find if offensive, I think you will be surprised at the result. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.44.212.34 (talk) 20:31, 13 January 2012 (UTC)[reply]

South Africans can't find the song amusing because, and I quote the song ...we're a bunch of ignorant loudmouths. With no sense of humour... --NJR_ZA (talk) 05:04, 14 January 2012 (UTC)[reply]

References[edit]

The above lyric issue, and the article as a whole needs to be based on reliable sources. The external link to h2g2 is UGC so cannot be used as a reliable source, meaning this article is unsourced. Widefox; talk 10:39, 30 March 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Notability?[edit]

I don't see anything in this stub of an article that makes it notable. What non-trivial coverage in multiple, independent RS has this song received? Was it newsworthy at the time of release, independent of "The Chicken Song"? If so, WP is not news. What has made this song anything other than a non-notable B-side of a popular single? Why does this song merit its own article? (It doesn't inherit notability from its writers, singer, A-side song, or even the TV show it came from.) Due to the potentially offensive nature of the subject (and clearly some have been offended), I think it's crucial that it be sourced well, right NOW, demonstrating notability according to WP:NSONG, or else merged or deleted. I applaud the intent of the song and I understand its supporters, but this still has the potential to offend, and IMO must be dealt with soon, according to the same standards we use for notability for all songs - WP:NSONG. I've done a search and found a number of incidental references and user-submitted content, but nothing that would meet WP:RS Dcs002 (talk) 09:18, 2 September 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Proposed merge with Spitting Image[edit]

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section. A summary of the conclusions reached follows.

The result was no consensus for a merge. Shhhnotsoloud (talk) 11:43, 14 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

(non-admin closure)

I think we should merge this article into Spitting Image. This article has been here for a long time with no sourcing and with very little content other than a summary of the lyrics. Whatever non-contentious content remains after sourcing should be merged with Spitting Image because the content will be in a better context on that page, and because notability of this song is doubtful on its own. It is a B-side of a successful single, and it doesn't appear to meet the criteria of WP:NSONG. Dcs002 (talk) 02:07, 6 September 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Inclined to agree, or perhaps it could be part of the Chicken Song article, since it was its B-side? Bob talk 21:54, 6 September 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Agree with Bob, it makes more sense to include it as a section of "The Chicken Song", as its B-side. Richard3120 (talk) 21:13, 21 October 2014 (UTC)[reply]

I'd go with that. If it is notable enough to have its own article it should include some critical reaction, but I doubt whether it created enough of an impact for that. Btljs (talk) 09:59, 11 November 2014 (UTC)[reply]

I think it is notable for its period and becomes more so as time passes. What is currently an external link Analysis of the lyrics while not in itself a reliable source shows the sort of information that this article could contain with reliable sources. So I think that the subject is quite encyclopaedic enough to warrant its own article as it has the potential to become an informative article about the period in which it was written.

I had a look at Google Scholar and this song is cited by three works. The title used for an academic paper (2009) [1] which is behind a pay-view wall so I am not sure of its relevance. It is mentioned in a book , a more interesting use is in

Modern Phobias by Tim Lihoreau (2011) a humerus book, but if one is not old enough to remember the song then looking it up with Google is a good reason to have an article here.[2]

The Spartan Supremacy 412-371 BC (2014) by Bob Bennett, Mike Roberts where they draw parallels between the views in the 1980s by "progressive people" about white South African supporters of apartheid and those by "progressive people" in Ancient Greece about Spartans.[3]. -- Again a good reason to have an article on it for those who read that book and want to know more about the song. As this is not a paper encyclopaedia there is no reason based on costs to want to delete this page and with references third party sources there is no reason to suppose that it is not suitable for an encyclopaedia entry.

-- PBS (talk) 15:24, 19 January 2015 (UTC)[reply]

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Offensiveness[edit]

Obviously lots of SA Afrikaners are going to find this song and its accompanying video offensive - it was intended to be offensive. I've just spent an hour sitting at the next table to a group of middle aged SA tourists, and some of their conversation would make your hair stand on end. The international reputation of Afrikaners is not wholly undeserved. --Ef80 (talk) 19:55, 4 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]