Talk:Polygyny/Archive 2

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Archive 1 Archive 2

Legality map

Utah supreme court declared last year that polygamy can't be banned because Amendment I. Map colour should be changed to that of "not fully criminalized." 216.137.192.89 (talk) 07:03, 8 January 2015 (UTC)

Sorry, but you are misinformed; to quote a well written summary, currently located on the cohabitation article:
On December 13, 2013, US Federal Judge Clark Waddoups ruled in Brown v. Buhman that the portions of Utah's anti-polygamy laws which prohibit multiple cohabitation were unconstitutional, but also allowed Utah to maintain its ban on multiple marriage licenses (Schwartz, John (September 14, 2013), "A Law Prohibiting Polygamy is Weakened", New York Times, retrieved 2014-01-13; Mears, Bill (December 14, 2013), "'Sister Wives' case: Judge strikes down part of Utah polygamy law", CNN.com, CNN, retrieved 2014-01-13; Stack, Peggy Fletcher (December 14, 2013), "Laws on Mormon polygamists lead to win for plural marriage", The Salt Lake Tribune, retrieved 2014-01-13). Unlawful cohabitation, where prosecutors did not need to prove that a marriage ceremony had taken place (only that a couple had lived together), had been a major tool used to prosecute polygamy in Utah since the 1882 Edmunds Act (Embry, Jessie L. (1994), "Polygamy", in Powell, Allan Kent (ed.), Utah History Encyclopedia, Salt Lake City, Utah: University of Utah Press, ISBN 0874804256, OCLC 30473917).
No changes are needed. —Asterisk*Splat→ 15:27, 8 January 2015 (UTC)

Map color labelling seems wrong. For Canada, USA, Australia and UK the dark grey color indicates that "Polygamy permitted and practiced". QunitusFabiusMaximus (talk) 12:22, 23 January 2016 (UTC)

Recent edits

Am I alone in thinking that 92slim's recent edits[1] (although helpful in some respects) have removed a lot of referenced information and left the article (esp. the lede) much less neutral? Uanfala (talk) 10:44, 27 June 2016 (UTC)

In the lede, I've removed source clutter and explained the current situation that explains the commonality and legality of polygamy in the most concise way; as bigamy only applies to certain jurisdictions, I've removed this reference from the lede as well. I've changed the titles of headings since they don't correspond with the text, namely the "extent" section didn't really explain the actual extent of polygyny neither any particular economic benefits since the actual reason being reproductive is underlined afterwards. It is explained that in fact it can be detrimental to families both socially and economically. I've removed references to levirate marriage, which is not polygyny, also removed an Iranian study funded by its totalitarian government and merged sections which come from the same article about Kenya, which was the only study critical to polygyny. I have merged the "countries" section with the main "Legal status" article, and added info on the religious aspect from the main "Polygamy" article. I don't see any changes in POV, and rather would say it reads slightly more neutral and free of information completely unrelated to the topic. --92slim (talk) 17:41, 27 June 2016 (UTC)
Sorry, my bad: I hadn't looked hard enough and was just knee-jerk reacting to the removal of a source and the mention of Muslim countries in the lede. Uanfala (talk) 20:38, 27 June 2016 (UTC)

Motive for taking another wife

From what I've read, at least sometimes a man takes a new wife because he wants a younger sexual partner. If this is true, shouldn't it be mentioned? Or does this happen only rarely? My impression from my readings is that it's rather frequent. deisenbe (talk) 18:42, 2 April 2015 (UTC)

As always, reliable sources are needed. Nell nell (talk) 14:14, 1 October 2016 (UTC)

Map of polygyny w.r.t. Russia

Copied from my talk page regarding the map, Russia, and a certain edit removing the map in its entirety:

In accordance with WP:PROVEIT "The burden to demonstrate verifiability lies with the editor who adds or restores material". Your will never find a reliable source proving existence of criminal liabilty for polygyny in Russia. So do not add the lying picture to the article, please. Раммон (talk) 12:50, 13 December 2016 (UTC)

@Раммон: I might suggest that, instead of edit warring over the picture in the English Wikipedia, you should go to Commons and see about having the image changed. If indeed the image is incorrect, then it should be fixed in all Wikipedias. --Izno (talk) 12:52, 13 December 2016 (UTC)
@Раммон: Additionally, the sources are provided lower down in the article. My read is that polygamy is effectively banned in Russia. --Izno (talk) 13:00, 13 December 2016 (UTC)
I do not care what your think about effectiveness of polygamy banning in Russia, but the section proves that there is no criminal punishment for polygamy in Russia. And the lying picture that your try to insert in the article asserts that there is criminal punishment for polygamy in Russia. Раммон (talk) 13:04, 13 December 2016 (UTC)
@Раммон: Let's talk to the original author--hopefully he is around. @92slim: On what sources did you base the coloring of File:Legality of polygamy.svg? --Izno (talk) 13:07, 13 December 2016 (UTC)

@92slim: Going to re-ping, though I noticed you haven't been on in a week and a half. I'll also leave a comment at the WikiProjects listed above. --Izno (talk) 13:44, 14 December 2016 (UTC)

@Раммон:@Izno: I have seen that the deletion request is waiting to be withdrawn since someone already has edited the map. Let me know if there are any other problems. Remember it's a SVG file, it can be edited safely with a vector graphics program. --92slim (talk) 06:53, 19 December 2016 (UTC)
92slim, the next mistake is Ukraine - Crimial Code of Ukraine does not contain such crime as polygamy or polygyny. It is unclear who was the ignoramuse that made this map. Раммон (talk) 11:50, 19 December 2016 (UTC)
@Раммон: I haven't made the map, it was already made, but in PNG format. All I did was transform it into a SVG file, so it can be edited. If you have objections to colours, you can edit it with a vector editor. It's pretty simple to use. --92slim (talk) 08:47, 20 December 2016 (UTC)
Edited Ukraine. Please next time, just edit the map if you know which country is wrong - don't ask me, I have no idea because I am not the maker of the map, the original maker made it in PNG version. --92slim (talk) 08:53, 20 December 2016 (UTC)

Polygyny in Africa and effects on women

If this article names Africa as the continent with the highest level of polygyny, why isn't there more elaboration on it other than the small segment on Kenya? Also, the effects on women subheading could use a lot more elaboration with the help of scholarly sources on 1) the relationships between co-wives and their children,and 2) the reproductive health aspect. Alizlev (talk) 03:02, 13 February 2017 (UTC)

Tone

All around great article! However, the first paragraph does not seem neutral to me. When I read it, I felt that the entire article would be dedicated to a comparison or double standards of polyandry instead of neutral facts on polygyny. I suggest editing or removing these two sentences in particular: Most countries that permit polygamy are Muslim-majority countries in which polygyny is the only form permitted. Polyandry is illegal in virtually every state of the world.

Jmilsap1 (talk) 23:06, 5 March 2017 (UTC)

Since the practice of polygyny is more widespread in Africa, I would suggest that more research and additional information is provided on how this is affecting families in Africa and why is Africa the leading continent in this practice. Without a doubt, polygyny causes jealousy and division among wives, but how are this differences reflecting on children of the several wives. It is also important to remember and point out that due globalization and the fact that many people are now leaving their villages in the search for better in capital cities, polygyny has slowed down a lot, especially among younger educated people.

Mbokoum1 (talk) 03:26, 6 March 2017 (UTC)

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Blue colors in polygamy map are indistinguishable

The image in the article that shows a map of polygyny across the world uses different shades of blue to show countries where:

  • Polygamy is legal
  • Polygamy is illegal, but practice is not criminalized

I feel the two shades of blue are indistinguishable. I look at a blue colored country in the map, and have no idea to which of the categories above the country belongs to.

How about we change the color of one of the category to a different color (such as red for instance)?

Akb236 (talk) 15:51, 2 November 2018 (UTC)

Incomplete sentence

The article says "It was accepted in ancient Greece, until the Roman Empire and the Roman Catholic Church." . Until the Roman Empire and the Roman Catholic Church... what? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Mrincodi (talk • contribs) 18:01, 7 September 2019 (UTC)

Macau

Maybe Macau should be added. Stanley Ho has four wives simultaneously. 109.156.176.232 (talk) 00:54, 4 March 2020 (UTC)

Why not have a list of famous people who practised polygyny?

Surely polygyny, as is defined in this article, is widely practised. For example by almost all known Hollywood people; the UK's current Prime Minister Boris Johnson, the UK's ex-PM John Major, the UK's Prince Charles, UK's opposition leader Jeremy Corbyn, sports personalities, entertainment personalities, US President Donald Trump, world politicians, and famous businessmen. Why not have a section about famous people who practised polygyny, as there are usually a list with peoples in other Wiki articles? 109.156.176.232 (talk) 01:06, 4 March 2020 (UTC)

And don't forget, by several Popes in history. 109.156.176.232 (talk) 01:24, 4 March 2020 (UTC)

Polyamorous

Is being polyamorous a form of polygyny? 109.156.176.156 (talk) 00:21, 11 March 2020 (UTC)

Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment

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Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment

This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 26 August 2019 and 11 December 2019. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): Hmiller19, Kswemley1, Aaliyahguery, Cdilek2.

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Parliament at Nuremberg in 1650

""On February 14, 1650, the parliament at Nürnberg decreed that, because so many men were killed during the Thirty Years' War, the churches for the following ten years could not admit any man under the age of 60 into a monastery. Priests and ministers not bound by any monastery were allowed to marry. Lastly, the decree stated that every man was allowed to marry up to ten women. The men were admonished to behave honorably, provide for their wives properly, and prevent animosity among them."

That is not true. I thought Wikipedia is a reputable encyclopedia?! Source 124 is not reliable (Larry O. Jensen, A Genealogical Handbook of German Research (Rev. Ed., 1980) p. 59.) There is no referece for this claim in this publication. Sources 127 and 128 declare it for not true: Leonhard Theobald, "Der angebliche Bigamiebeschluß des fränkischen Kreistages" ["The So-called Bigamy Decision of the Franconian Kreistag"], Beitrage zur Bayerischen kirchengeschichte [Contributions to Bavarian Church History] 23 (1916 – bound volume dated 1917) Erlangen: 199–200 (Theobald reporting that the Franconian Kreistag did not hold session between 1645 and 1664, and that there is no record of such a law in the extant archives of Nürnberg, Ansbach, or Bamberg, Theobald believing that the editors of the Fränkisches Archiv must have misunderstood a draft of some other legislation from 1650). Alfred Altmann, "Verein für Geschichte der Stadt Nürnburg," Jahresbericht über das 43 Vereinsjahr 1920 [Annual Report for the 43rd Year 1920 of the Historical Society of the City of Nuremberg] (Nürnberg 1920): 13–15 (Altmann reporting a lecture he had given discussing the polygamy permission said to have been granted in Nuremberg in 1650, Altmann characterizing the Fränkisches Archiv as "merely a popular journal, not an edition of state documents," and describing the tradition as "a literary fantasy")

Even if it were true, it would be a political decision, not a religious one. So it's not appropriate to have this quote under the headline "Christianity".--Castizo.de (talk) 14:41, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

I removed the text for the above reasons as some of the sources cited actualy contradicted this claim as an urban legend.2A02:2F0F:B1FF:FFFF:0:0:6463:D1C8 (talk) 13:22, 4 April 2022 (UTC)

Too critical

This article as a whole is overly and one-sidedly critical of the practice it describes. Criticism should be listed in the appropriate section. 2A02:A420:4B:A321:C5EF:C774:62CE:F79F (talk) 11:31, 31 May 2022 (UTC)

Criminalized?

Is it really criminalized in western world? And if that's so, how? No one can marry more than one person due to laws, and extramarital relationships are legal, so how can someone commit this crime? Martianmister (talk) 12:57, 12 October 2022 (UTC)

Not a neutral view

This article only cites negative viewpoints or information which may not have anything to do with the topic. Suggesting many articles about African warfare and violence is linked to polygyny, is obsurd. Causes for violence occur in every society. Negative viewpoints stating polygyny is less likely to succeed than monogamy is false and has no scientific basis. I have scientific journal studies in both culture and psychology that show otherwise. This article seems to promote only feminist ideology, and not a neutral viewpoint. 63.245.158.182 (talk) 01:15, 29 October 2022 (UTC)

Judaism subsection

The claim that Moses had three wives is certainly not a traditional one, most traditional sources would assert that all three ‘women’ are really the same woman described in three different ways. Also many other important figures had multiple wives, like Abraham and Jacob, Esau who was a minor figure and Moses who only had one wife- are hardly necessary for the point to be made. This should be revised. Also, Karaite Jews should be a separate section as neither they nor traditional Jews consider each other of the same faith or possibly even ethnicity. The Theory of Knowledge (talk) 19:47, 29 December 2022 (UTC)

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