Talk:Nezak Huns/GA1

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GA Review[edit]

Passed. Iazyges Consermonor Opus meum 21:20, 15 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

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Reviewer: Iazyges (talk · contribs) 03:09, 27 January 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Article has been sitting at GAN for an unconscionable time ;), will take it up. Iazyges Consermonor Opus meum 03:09, 27 January 2023 (UTC)[reply]

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Criteria[edit]

GA Criteria

GA Criteria:

  • 1
    1.a 
    1.b 
  • 2
    2.a 
    2.b 
    2.c 
    2.d 
  • 3
    3.a 
    3.b 
  • 4
    4.a 
  • 5
    5.a 
  • 6
    6.a 
    6.b 
  • No DAB links checkY
  • No dead links checkY
  • No missing citations ☒N: No literature from Nezak courts survives and the only mentions of the Nezak Huns are recorded in Chinese chronicles. Arabic historians also recorded the end of the dynasty. No epigraphic inscriptions apart from coinage are known.
    Some samples include a Brahmi akshara of uncertain significance beneath the ribbons.
    Two Brahmi aksharas are present in some samples.
    @TrangaBellam: I've made a list of missing citations above; many footnotes also are missing citations. please address them. Thank you! Iazyges Consermonor Opus meum 16:12, 27 January 2023 (UTC)[reply]
    Also, it seems like most of the longer footnotes would better serve as prose text. Iazyges Consermonor Opus meum 16:12, 27 January 2023 (UTC)[reply]
    Also, footnote u lacks a page number for Kuwayama. Iazyges Consermonor Opus meum 16:26, 27 January 2023 (UTC)[reply]
    Will add the missing citations. Give me a couple of days. Best, TrangaBellam (talk) 16:55, 27 January 2023 (UTC)[reply]
    No problem, there's no rush. Just let me know when you're finished. Iazyges Consermonor Opus meum 17:00, 27 January 2023 (UTC)[reply]
    Sure. Btw, I agree that some of the footnotes need to be shifted to text. TrangaBellam (talk) 11:35, 28 January 2023 (UTC)[reply]
    I plan to integrate the following footnotes with text:
    b
    d
    Parts of q
    Parts of u.
    Besides, footnote m needs a rewrite. The rest looks all good except for inline citations, which I will add. TrangaBellam (talk) 16:45, 2 February 2023 (UTC)[reply]
    Going ahead. TrangaBellam (talk) 09:32, 9 February 2023 (UTC)[reply]
     Done except for a single footnote which I need some time to understand (lol) and re-draft. TrangaBellam (talk) 12:16, 11 February 2023 (UTC)[reply]
     Done. We need a nice map in the section on territory. TrangaBellam (talk) 13:28, 25 February 2023 (UTC)[reply]
    Whoops, I completely missed this; starting the review now. Iazyges Consermonor Opus meum 15:20, 9 March 2023 (UTC)[reply]
  • Spotchecks good checkY

Discussion[edit]

Prose Suggestions[edit]

Please note that almost all of these are suggestions, and can be implemented or ignored at your discretion. Any changes I deem necessary for the article to pass GA standards I will bold.

Lede[edit]

  • No lede suggestions except that perhaps a bit more could be added; don't view it as critical, however. Iazyges Consermonor Opus meum 15:27, 9 March 2023 (UTC)[reply]
    Good point; I will appreciate some precise suggestions. TrangaBellam (talk) 09:09, 1 June 2023 (UTC)[reply]
    I think the best way would be to give a high-level overview of the coinage phases, and expand the history part to have more detail. Iazyges Consermonor Opus meum 18:13, 23 June 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Etymology[edit]

  • the former was used only to describe the Nezak Tarkhans Due to being very similar to the article subject in name, I think a brief gloss should be given, perhaps the former was used only to describe the Nezak Tarkhans (Western Tokharistan rulers), or something similar.
     Done

Territory[edit]

  • Feels like this whole section would benefit from being moved to the first subsection of the history section.
    Uncertain.
  • c. 630, during Xuanzang's visit, Kapisi composed eleven vassal-principalities, including Lampā, Varṇu, Nagarahāra, and Gandhara; Taxila had been only recently lost to Kashmir. suggest Kapisi composed eleven vassal-principalities during Xuanzang's visit in c. 630, including Lampā, Varṇu, Nagarahāra, and Gandhara; Taxila had been only recently lost to Kashmir.
     Done

Pilgrim Travelogues[edit]

  • Dharmagupta (d. 619), a South-Indian Buddhist monk, had suggest removing (d. 619)
     Done
  • Dharmagupta (d. 619), a South-Indian Buddhist monk, had visited the polity in the early seventh century, but his biography by Yan Cong is not extant. the phrasing here, hinging largely around the usage of had seems to imply that Dharmagupta visited before Jñānagupta, but the literary work associated with it was lost. As the timing is at least 50 years later, I think removing had would make it less confusing.
     Done

Chinese Histories[edit]

  • The Cefu Yuangui and Old Book of Tang should give brief introductions for both works, such as The Cefu Yuangui (a 11th-century Chinese encyclopedia)
     Done
  • Footnote c should have a citation.
     Doing... - I failed to find a source, the last time. Need to read all of the cited works, again.
  • Footnote d, while written very academically, is strange to see in Wikivoice; it would look more normal I think, as Minoru Inaba gives a list of the sixteen prefectures: [list]
    Removed.  Done
  • Ziad, however, cautions the reference to twelve generations was probably not intended in the literal sense Ziad has not yet been introduced.
     Done

Phase I[edit]

  • but incorporated Alkhon iconography alongside their distinctive styles Should introduce the Alchon huns, as they are far more obscure than the Sassanians, and have not been introudced in any fashion in the body yet. Also, this is the only usage of Alkhon instead of Alchon in the article, which I assume is accidental?
    Typo fixed
  • Coins exhibit progressive debasement as silver decrease in favour of alloys incorporating increasing quantities of copper. suggest The coinage exhibits a progressive debasement as the silver percentage decreases in favour of alloys incorporating increasing quantities of copper
     Done
  • A wing-shaped vegetal appendage a short gloss on what vegetal appendage means would be nice. Like flower petals, is what it seems to me, but I can imagine non-native and non-expect English speakers struggling pretty hard to understand it.
    Your understanding is correct; care to give a pointer on how to better describe it for non-native speakers?
    Perhaps A wing-shaped vegetal appendage (shaped similar to flower petals)? Iazyges Consermonor Opus meum 18:10, 23 June 2023 (UTC)[reply]
    Unsatisfactory. TrangaBellam (talk) 21:18, 18 July 2023 (UTC)[reply]
  • some samples include a Brahmi akshara a short gloss for akshara would be useful.
     Doing...
  • footnote j ( Numismatists use this mark to group Nezak coinage into two types; there is a consensus among scholars the latter type started earlier than the former. should IMO be pulled up into prose and cited.
     Not done Not very significant information, I believe.
  • footnote k ( The long barsom bundles were likely derived from the mints of Yazdegerd II, who preceded Peroz I.) should also be pulled up into prose and cited.

Phase II: Alchon-Nezak crossovers and derivatives[edit]

  • Footnote l (Whether these two varieties were contemporaneous remains a matter of speculation.) should be pulled up to prose and cited, IMO.
  •  Not done Better suited to footnote.
  • For footnote m, the Gandhara was added to Nezak territory only in the aftermath of Alchon desertion is confusing to me, what desertion? Is this meant to mean that the Alchons abandoned the Sakra region and the Nezaks took over? Or is it, as the became "extinct" and the unavailability of Phase I mints affirm such a view. after the death of the Alchons, which seems incorrect, as the Alchons seem to have briefly outlived them.
  • Footnote n could be pulled up into prose, IMO.
  •  Doing...

Origins and establishment[edit]

  • However, Shōshin Kuwayama—primarily depending on Xuanzang's recording the rulers of Kapisi as Kshatriya, about two centuries later, and the absence of Hunnic identifiers in coinage—ascribes an indigenous origin to the dynasty. given the long list of names and people, it may be useful to reorganize to However, Shōshin Kuwayama ascribes an indigenous origin to the dynasty, primarily depending on Xuanzang's recording the rulers of Kapisi as Kshatriya, about two centuries later, and the absence of Hunnic identifiers in coinage.
     Not done
  • However, Shōshin Kuwayama—primarily depending on Xuanzang's recording the rulers of Kapisi as Kshatriya additionally, while linked above, the term Kshatriya has not been defined, recommend a short gloss.
     Not done Read this line with the last line of the section on pilgrim travelogues.
  • Vondrovec finds his arguments to be unpersuasive. Vondrovec has not been introduced in the body.
     Done
  • and Hindu societies had a history of absorbing alien warriors within the Kshatriya fold. foreign may work better than alien
     Done

Decline: Rashidun and Umayyad invasions[edit]

  • probably first in Kabul and later throughout the territory, sometime soon sometime soon is not exactly the right phrasing, suggest changing sometime soon to soon after
     Done
  • According to Hyecho Hyecho should be introduced.
     Done
  • Footnote r is huge and not very useful, strongly suggest removal.
     Doing... Maybe, pull up to the section on sources?
    That could work; although it is quite a long quote that I'm not sure the reader gets much out of. Iazyges Consermonor Opus meum 18:11, 23 June 2023 (UTC)[reply]
    Doing. TrangaBellam (talk) 21:16, 18 July 2023 (UTC)[reply]
  • Kabul (city - ?) Is it not certain here if Kabul refers to the region or the city? If so, suggest Kabul (either the city or the region)
     Done

Notes[edit]

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
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