Talk:Laestadianism

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Untitled[edit]

I'm removing the blurb about how Laestadians commonly have 10-15 children and get married young. It seems irrelevant and lacks a good source. Please feel free to re-add if you have a source for this.

-- Joshua Rodd — Preceding unsigned comment added by 155.188.255.3 (talk) 16:41, 30 November 2005 (UTC)[reply]

This is a natural delusion from the fact they don't use contraception... Kahkonen 18:09, 30 November 2005 (UTC)[reply]

This article is generally about laestadianism. Not all laestadian branches think contraception is a sin. Operationkunskap 18:09, 29 March 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Poorly sourced or unsourced information is a problem with a huge percentage of Wiki writing, and applying the rule evenly would reduce this and thousands of Wiki articles to just a couple sentences. I think it would better serve the goal of providing quality information for readers to *qualify* relevant information that has some basis in fact rather than delete it. <new paragraph> It's not accurate to suggest the anti-contraception belief is not relevant. The war that's been raging recently over President Obama's mandated contraception insurance plan illustrates the relevance *and* the highly religious, denomination-specific nature of this belief. <new paragraph> This article's accuracy for all its faults has improved greatly because some careful contributors have tried to differentiate the sub-groups within North America AND Finland and the Finnish membership from the North American. Contributors should always remember to use this framework as a *filter* when adding new information, taking care to specify to what portion of Laestadianism as a whole the new information applies. Paavo273 (talk) 08:18, 3 March 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Not Exactly NPOV[edit]

The guideline of their faith is the Bible.

That pretty much covers any Christian denomination.

Laestadians emphasize a Christian lifestyle.

Again, how is this different from any other Christian denomination?

Laestadius met a Lappish woman named Milla Clementsdotter of Föllinge, during a 1844 inspection tour of Åsele, who narrated various biblical teachings to Laestadius. This was an important meeting for Laestadius, because after it, he first understood the secret of living faith.

This seems a little POV to me, particularly the reference to "the secret of living faith."

He received his sins forgiven

Not even sure what this means.

I'm not really familiar with this denomination, so I'm reluctant (Be Bold notwithstanding) to muck around with it, but it surely looks as though it could use a cleanup.

Septegram 14:10, 28 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

OK, since no one has offered to work on this, I made a couple of minor changes, and am unwatching. You're on your collective own...

*Septegram*Talk*Contributions* 13:18, 22 March 2007 (UTC)[reply]

This not-NPOV still remaining:

She told Laestadius about her spiritual experiences on her journey to a truly living Christianity.

I believe the expression "truly living Christianity" could be a citation, and then it needs double blips (") and a citation. Said: Rursus (☻) 11:22, 7 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Finnish translation[edit]

Tried to translate from fi-wiki. Cites and references are in Finnish, so I didn't copy them. Kahkonen 09:26, 20 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks, and I hope you are also willing to translate the remaining parts of the Finnish article :) Labongo 14:19, 20 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Not in near future, sorry :-) Kahkonen 15:53, 20 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Exclusion[edit]

The article implies "a difference between believers and others". According to Laestadean doctrine / opinion, what is the actual meaning of this 'difference', and who are the 'believers' (what is necessary or sufficient property of a "true believer")? IMO the declared discussion should be included in the article.

-- kyyni — Preceding undated comment added 22:30, 20 April 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I don't know if this is correct (and will therefore not change the article), but I think a believer is a Laestadian. I also don't think that they regard others are regarded as non-believers in the sence of not being Christians. Labongo 22:36, 20 April 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Labongo is correct but I'll add a caveat - many of the subsects of Laestadianism believe that only their subsect contains the "true" believers, and that every other religion is following man instead of God. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.41.62.5 (talk) 18:13, 26 June 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Dissent from conservatives[edit]

The article should really consider looking into whether there has ever been any doctrinal dissent from conservatives within the Church of Finland, who might feel alienated about decisions surrounding the ordination of women or the blessing of same-sex marriages. It is possible to imagine that if this dissent were not healed, many of these conservatives would consider forming their own ecclesial community, which might be tempted to reunite with the Catholic Church, such as recently seen with the Traditional Anglican Communion. ADM (talk) 15:59, 11 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

It is not polite to copy-paste the same question to two different talk pages in order to generate discussion. This might be considered a flame-bait. In addition, the name of the church is "Evangelical Lutheran Church of Finland", which has been in use since 1809. (The adjective has been necessary to distinguish from the Orthodox church.)

Actually, the Evangelical Lutheran Church of Finland does not bless same-sex unions, although it does ordain women. The former is a subject of lively discussion, as you might imagine, while the latter faces severe opposition from conservatives. Especially, the Laestadians and evankeliset oppose the practice. However, a formal breach has not yet been discussed. --MPorciusCato (talk) 15:46, 11 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Reliable source?[edit]

This sentence: "It is the biggest revivalist movement in the Nordic countries.[1]" is sourced with information from the website of the movement in question. That is hardly a reliable source for this. If no one objects I will remove it and replace it with a "citation needed" tag. --Saddhiyama (talk) 21:22, 7 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Done. --Saddhiyama (talk) 09:17, 9 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I think it's better to just add a {{better source}} template after the low-quality source. Rursus dixit. (^mbork³!) 20:40, 25 May 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Did so. Rursus dixit. (^mbork³!) 20:42, 25 May 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Rel adding headings and removal of some tags[edit]

1. 'Removed too long intro tag, added headings, etc. Thanks to all the contributors who have made this article almost unrecognizable in a positive way from what it was a couple years ago, who have added inline citations, who watch for hit and run vandalism, etc. Paavo273 19:09, 4 July 2013 (UTC) Revised by Paavo273 (talk) 03:03, 8 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Anyone interested in authoring or co-authoring a new section or sections on scandals and controversies in Laestadianism?[edit]

Is anyone interested in contributing alone or as a joint effort a section on one or more of the following: 1. the child molestation scandals, 2. woman ordaining controversy, 3. Scientology-like interrogations of the '70s, and/or 4. spouse abuse and treatment of women in general? I'd be happy to share my English-language sources with you. Access to Finnish-language sources w/b huge help.

Expanding article would provide a valuable service.

Should Kautokeino rebellion be included in article?

If you prefer to reply by email, see Wikipedia:Emailing users.

Paavo273 03:17, 8 September 2013 (UTC) Revised by Paavo273 (talk) 22:42, 15 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]

"It is the biggest revivalist movement in the Nordic countries"[edit]

How can that be, if it claims about 200k members, but that some other revivalist movements which are now worldwide (including in Nordic countries) have several million members? 76.10.128.192 (talk) 20:30, 27 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Think of some imaginary worldwide group that has 2 billion members, but out of those 2 billion members, only 35 of them live in Nordic countries. That kind of thing is why it's possible. (Of course this only shows it's easily possible, not whether it's true or false.) TooManyFingers (talk) 13:11, 24 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

External links modified[edit]

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Famous Laestadians, anyone?[edit]

This editor would be grateful if other editors would add the names of any additional famous active or past Laestadians. They certainly do NOT need to be notable by WP standards to be included. For example, anyone here know or know OF the Laestadian Finnish chain goods store owner from Ostrobothnia probably? He is widely known because he has a lot of stores, AND he was in the Finnish news some years back due to a controversy over some book(s) that were being sold at his chain of stores. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 93.106.7.109 (talk) 16:13, 12 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]