Talk:K'un-lun po

Do not direct to Early Chola as the article differs from the main article Early Chola. --Anton017 (talk) 12:20, 17 July 2013 (UTC)

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Unfocused

It's not entirely clear what the topic of the article is, as it seems to discuss reports of various ships over many centuries, and with or without sourcing, it's not clear that these are talking about the same thing, or are simply individual reports about ships that may or may not be connected in some way. The history section talks about ships mentioned in The Geography in 150 AD, in Periplus (1st c.), in a 3rd century Chinese source, 5th, 9th, 12th and 14th c. Chinese accounts.

Most of this is sourced, but where is the source which identifies these as tied in some way to a single topic, as opposed to being separate accounts, unrelated except for their provenance from numerous reporters that happen to use the same language to describe various ships over a period of thirteen centuries? As it is sourced, all this material should surely be usable somewhere, but it seems like WP:SYNTH to include it all in one place, absent some secondary source tying them all together.

The earliest versions of the article (e.g., Oct. 2011) when it was called Colandia were about this:

Colandia - The great ships which was used by Early Cholas. By this they sailed to pacific islands from Kaveripatnam(as center). At that time, Pattinathu Pillai is the chief of the Chola's Navy.

By Aug 2017, it had expanded to a paragraph and four references, still about the Chola Colandia.

By June 2020, the lead sentence and paragraph hadn't much changed, but it was expanded to identify the term Colandia as a transcription of a Chinese name for a Javan vessel; at that point, paragraph two was this:

It is now generally accepted that rather than being an Indian name for an Indian vessel kolandiaphonta was a straightforward transcription of the Chinese term Kun-lun-po, which refers to Indonesian vessel (see jong ship). The Sangara is likely to have been derived from an Indonesian twin-hulled design similar to some of the multi-hulled vessels in which mariners explored much of the Pacific.

In Feb. 2022 the article was moved to K'un-lun po (diff), followed by a large addition of text (diff) copied from Djong (ship) which tripled it in size and brought it close to its current state, less some copyediting and the Infobox added later. The oldest material about the Chola Colandia was still there, relegated to the § Controversy section.

If all of these accounts really refer to a single topic, we should have a single source that says so that we can rely on. Conversely, if we cannot, then it is WP:SYNTH and WP:OR to include it all in one place, and the material should either be removed, or farmed out to such articles at which the content is relevant to the topic. In the former case, the lead paragraph should be rewritten in some way to define the topic as a single concept that spanned over a millenium. Mathglot (talk) 02:07, 5 December 2023 (UTC)

Now I see that Colandia exists as a separate article, which further complicates the issue of what the topic of this one is, as it also covers the Indian vessel. Probably either there should be a merge-and-redirect, or all of the Colandia information in this article should be moved to Colandia, with just a brief section here with a {{Main}} link pointing to it following summary style. But that's only if they are related, but different; if they are the same thing, then it has to be a merge, which brings us back to the "what's the topic of this article" question. Mathglot (talk) 23:30, 5 December 2023 (UTC)