Talk:Dhobi Ghat

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Narrow scope of this article[edit]

I think this page is too narrow in scope-- a 'Dhobi Ghat' is NOT just an open air laundromat in Mumbai, India, bit is also the common term/word for washing places where the dhobis (traditional washermen and women) go to wash clothes-- it is used for such places throughout India, Pakistan and Bangladesh, to the best of my knowledge. The word comprises of 'dhobi/dhoby' (i.e. washer) and 'ghat' (or 'ghaut') (ie a place). Maybe, if there is already a separate page about this topic, then they should have a disambiguation page, to help out researchers? Thanks

I support the above opinion (dating from 2012, ie. 9 years ago). Is no-one willing to do something about it? -- jw (talk) 21:31, 3 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

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Laundromat? Lavoir?[edit]

Dhobi Ghat in Mumbai is a laundry place, where dhobis or laundry(men) work; but (in my opinion) not a laundromat or a lavoir, which have different meanings and scope from Dhobi ghat. -- jw (talk) 21:35, 3 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Rsrikanth05 Please consider this, in addition to the above section (narrow scope), and reconsider your recent modification to lavoir, which in my opinion is unnecessary. Perhaps we could work together to improve both these articles? -- jw (talk) 21:35, 3 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
@Jwikip:, I merely added that because I redirected Dhobi ghat (NOT Dhobi Ghat) to Lavoir. Dhobi Ghat is not just a place where the laundry is done but also a locality in Mumbai. Dhobi ghat meanwhile is a common noun. --Rsrikanth05 (talk) 11:02, 4 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
When I wrote yesterday Rsrikanth05, I didn't clearly distinguish between the Dhobi Ghat in Mumbai vs. Dhobi ghat; I am aware of the conflicting meanings, which shold be clarified. Please note the following:
  • A lavoir is a public washing-place where ordinary people (i.e. not necessarily dhobi service-providers) come to do their washing.
  • The 'Mumbai Dhobi Ghat' is one of many larger or smaller dhobi ghats in India and elsewhere.
  • There are hundreds of other pages that point to Lavoir. Why favour one only for a mention? - I do not support favoring just one page with a hard-coded mention on 'Lavoir' - especially because when the redirect from 'Dhobi ghat' functions, this is automatically noted anyway -- jw (talk) 19:56, 4 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
The above differences are too subtle for ordinary Wikipedia readers (including myself) to understand when reading the current setup. Rsrikanth05 I suggest the following resolution, which would be a basis for collaboration:
  1. Move this Dhobi Ghat page to Dhobi Ghat (Mumbai) or Mahalaxshmi Dhobi Ghat or Mumbai Dhobi Ghat(your choice).
  2. In this (moved) page: describe the M.. Dhobi Ghat as a laundry place or a Dhobi ghat (remove reference to laundromat or lavoir, as this is a place where dhobis work).
  3. In redirect page Dhobi ghat: turn off redirect, include information to explain the expression Dhobi ghat. Include links to Lavoir, and to Laundry, with appropriate explanation of subtle differences.
  4. Create new page Dhobi ghat (disambiguation) pointing to the above and and others, including the Singapore, Penang, and Kolkata instances, Dhobaghat, the film(s) etc., etc. -- jw (talk) 20:01, 4 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support. I broadly support these changes (although I think at (1) you meant "Move this Dhobi Ghat page...). In the end "Dhobi ghat" would be a short article about the meaning of the phrase; "Dhobi Ghat" I assume would be a redirect to the disambiguation page "Dhobi ghat (disambiguation)" (although that would work equally the other way round). I am happy to write the disambiguation page and move pages if you wish: I suggest "Dhobi ghat" is converted to an article first. Shhhnotsoloud (talk) 09:04, 8 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
thank you @Shhhnotsoloud: In the light of your suggestion I have corrected my suggested course of action, above. I agree that two different pages with Upper and lower case Dhobi ☆hat are and will continue to be confusing for most users. I have not received any response from @Rsrikanth05:, let us await that as well as any other reactions. -- jw (talk) 20:26, 8 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
@Jwikip: in the light of no objections or further comment I'm happy to help you do this. Would you like to overwrite the redirect Dhobi ghat and then I'll make the moves. Shhhnotsoloud (talk) 08:44, 25 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Shhhnotsoloud Sorry I have been somewhat off line lately.
Are we still waiting for Rsrikanth05?
I would add a fifth point to the list of 4 actions above; I hope you agree:
3b. Remove "Dhobi ghat etc" disambiguation from Lavoir hatnote. - there are many many other pages that also direct to Lavoir; "Dhobi ghat" is out of place here and should not be favoured compared to the others [see my previous response to "Narrow Scope", above]. -- jw (talk) 22:27, 1 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]
@Jwikip:. Let's go ahead. I'm happy to do the page moves and make the disambiguation page if you first overwrite the redirect Dhobi ghat with an article. Shhhnotsoloud (talk) 08:35, 2 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]
@Shhhnotsoloud: yes, let's go ahead
see user:Jwikip/sandbox and feel free to improve it. It may take a while to seriously complete this short text ... and/but note that I am not in any way a laundering specialist nor a hindi-speaker; and I know of no references or citations whatsoever for the content of the article! Perhaps you can help with the latter, one doesn't want/need to be shot down in flames by the rest of the wikiworld, although I am willing to take risks -- jw (talk) 13:04, 2 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Let me work on it. Shhhnotsoloud (talk) 13:14, 2 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

 Done although I left Dhobi Ghat at the capitalised title. Shhhnotsoloud (talk) 20:45, 2 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@Shhhnotsoloud: yes, I like the result, thank you! ... but ... we now have three pages named Dhobi G/ghat instead of one!
In order to keep things simple and avoid confusion, Dhobi Ghat still has to be moved to Mahalaxmi Dhobi Ghat per our agreed list of tasks. Note that Mahalaxmi (or Mahalakshmi), it is the name of the neighbourhood around the Mahalakshmi temple, not the actual name of the Mumbai laundry-place. So a change or two in some of the other pages are necessary in addition to the move. --jw (talk) 13:49, 5 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]
@Jwikip: I think on reflection that Dhobi Ghat at that capitalisation doesn't need to be moved because it's fine as it is (in the spirit of WP:PRECISE and WP:DIFFCAPS). That is to say, if it was up to me alone I wouldn't move it. Of course there could be a WP:Requested move. You might like to create a few redirects (such as the redlink Mahalaxmi Dhobi Ghat). Shhhnotsoloud (talk) 14:15, 5 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]
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