Talk:Cleveland/Archive 4

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Requested move 22 November 2017

Cleveland → Cleveland, Ohio
Cleveland → redirect to Cleveland, Ohio – We need take a look at this very closely. This is without a doubt the primary topic. However, titling it simply as "Cleveland" implies that it is the overwhelmingly primary topic. It is not. While most Cleveland's are insignificant compared to this city, Cleveland, Tennessee is a well-established city of about 45,000 that is ranked fourteenth largest in population in its state and fifth largest industrially. That latter figure is up there with cities as large as Cleveland, Ohio. 146.229.240.200 (talk) 00:41, 22 November 2017 (UTC)

  • Oppose. Compare the Clevelands. Answer each of these questions the way a general American will answer it.
  1. What city are you going towards if you're heading north on I-71 from Columbus, Ohio??
  2. What city are you going towards if you're heading east on I-80 or I-90 from Toledo, Ohio??
  3. What city are you going towards if you're heading west on I-80 from Youngstown, Ohio??
  4. What city are you going towards if you're heading west on I-90 from Erie, Pennsylvania??
  5. What city are you going towards if you're heading north on I-75 from Chattanooga, Tennessee??
  6. What city are you going towards if you're heading south on I-75 from Knoxville, Tennessee??

The answers to each question are Cleveland, Cleveland, Cleveland, Cleveland, Knoxville, Chattanooga. Georgia guy (talk) 00:51, 22 November 2017 (UTC)

  • Withdrawing request- I sincerily apologize. We really need to discuss this more before requesting. 146.229.240.200 (talk) 01:27, 22 November 2017 (UTC)
The request was made to hastily. I will note, however, that cities as small as 30,000 to 50,000 are sometimes referred to as the target cities on interstates. Example: Valdosta, Georgia, Auburn, Alabama, Bristol, TN/VA, Kingsport, TN, etc. Also, I'll note that "Knoxville, Tennessee" and "Chattanooga, Tennessee" are primary topics, with no other city near as much of a challenge as Cleveland, TN (or Cleveland, MS for that matter) is to Cleveland, OH. However, they are not titled "Chattanooga" or "Knoxville"; those are redirects. However, these are poor arguments, and I actually wouldn't be opposed to moving Chattanooga, and maybe even Knoxville. Also note that Cleveland, TN is not part of the Chattanooga metro area; it has its own metro area. I'd like for other users to seriously take a look at this and really consider before we request another move. 146.229.240.200 (talk) 01:38, 22 November 2017 (UTC)
Agreed. This is not the overwhelmingly primary topic. As is mentioned, Cleveland, TN, a relatively large city with apparently one of the largest industrial economies in the world, is very significant. But don't forget about the surname Cleveland. There several notable people with this name, perhaps the most notable being a former President of the United States, whom most people have heard of. A comparisom of this situation would be Washington State. Most people would agree that the state is the primary topic for places with just the name "Washington." But nobody would support moving the name to "Washington" because of the significance of George Washington and Washington, D.C. This is a very similar situation here. If this request were opened again, I would support it, but only exactly the way it was requested. Please take note of this if it is opened again. 184.43.19.237 (talk) 20:40, 23 November 2017 (UTC)

Languages

I'm surprised not to see Slovenian specifically listed among the Slavic languages spoken in Cleveland. The Slovenian version of this article (which is very short) includes the following statement: 'Največji delež od 300.000 Slovencev, ki živijo v severni Ameriki, živi v Clevelandu. Tam imajo svoja društva, v katerih ohranjajo kulturno izročilo svoje domovine. Kljub temu, da večina ne govori več slovensko, se mnogi od njih še čutijo Slovence in se tako tudi javno opredeljujejo.' ('The majority of the 300,000 Slovenes that live in North America live in Cleveland. There they have their own associations in which they preserve the cultural tradition of their homeland. Although most of them no longer speak Slovenian, many of them still feel Slovenian and identify publicly as such.') Although 'most of them' no longer speak the language, I find it hard to believe there are not more a thousand speakers out of the 'majority' of 300,000 Slovenes in North America. Can't help wondering if this is part of a general tendency - which I've noticed over the years - to overlook Slovenia on maps, in historical accounts and so on.213.127.210.95 (talk) 14:34, 21 November 2017 (UTC)

Just visit some of the old Eastern European neighborhoods, like South Broadway or Buckeye Road, and aside from old inscriptions on old buildings, you'll see basically nothing except English or Spanish. There's a reason that the old national parishes have been closing; see the history of St. Elizabeth of Hungary Catholic Church for example. Nyttend (talk) 13:04, 11 January 2018 (UTC)
Not necessarily true. I know that St. Vitus in the St. Clair neighborhood and St. Mary's in Collinwood both do mass in English and Slovenian. And St. Emeric over in Ohio City (adjacent the WSM) does mass in Hungarian. And there are others too. Thing is, the West Side and East Side of Cleveland are two distinctly different areas culturally. Slavic Village and Buckeye (both of which you reference in your reply) are on the East Side where white flight hit the hardest in the 50s and 60s. The European community largely up and moved to the burbs, or went west (I grew up close to Murray Hill, which is still today the only sizeable predominantly white neighborhood on the East Side of the city and watched as South Euclid and Cleveland Heights white European population shrink drastically. But the West Side, while it has always had a sizeable Puerto Rican community, is still more white European than anything else. The east side is predominatly African American.Ryecatcher773 (talk) 18:17, 11 January 2018 (UTC)

Nomination of Portal:Cleveland for deletion

A discussion is taking place as to whether Portal:Cleveland is suitable for inclusion in Wikipedia according to Wikipedia's policies and guidelines or whether it should be deleted.

The page will be discussed at Wikipedia:Miscellany for deletion/Portal:Cleveland until a consensus is reached, and anyone is welcome to contribute to the discussion. The nomination will explain the policies and guidelines which are of concern. The discussion focuses on high-quality evidence and our policies and guidelines.

Users may edit the page during the discussion, including to improve the page to address concerns raised in the discussion. However, do not remove the deletion notice from the top of the page. North America1000 05:57, 6 June 2019 (UTC)

Infobox collage is not dynamic

The infobox collage makes it very hard to see any of the photos full-sized. You could solve this either the way London does it or the way Washington, D.C. does it, but I'd recommend one or the other in order to keep this page in featured shape. {{u|Sdkb}} talk 07:18, 27 December 2020 (UTC)

Population

2020 census shows drop in population. I made a small adjustment in the body of the article, but the infobox needs updating. Not sure about some of the parameters and would appreciate someone helping. thanks. MartinezMD (talk) 22:35, 12 August 2021 (UTC)

Incorrect rendering of maplink (image_map)

The first maplink in this article's infobox does not render properly. I checked the OSM/Wikidata links[1][2] according to this guide, but it was not immediately obvious to me what the issue might be. Even with an explicit ID for the template, the OSM shape data does not seem to load properly. After some research, I discovered it's a known bug.[3] — Preceding unsigned comment added by 187.3.3.14 (talk) 19:30, 15 August 2021 (UTC)

Crime Section Outdated

This article states crime in Cleveland has declined, using data that's nearly 5 years old. Cleveland's crime rate is surging and it has made national headlines since 2020.

https://www.cleveland19.com/2021/01/04/clevelands-rise-violent-crime-makes-national-headlines-city-leaders-react/

example

This is outdated and must be updated Wordbearer88 (talk) 04:29, 1 December 2021 (UTC)

References

  1. ^ https://www.openstreetmap.org/relation/182130
  2. ^ https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q37320
  3. ^ https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T218097

Quick bites > interactive maps broken

Quick bites > interactive maps gives "invalid coordinates" message 172.58.196.14 (talk) 06:16, 21 January 2022 (UTC)

Only when not logged in. SalineBrain (talk) 06:24, 21 January 2022 (UTC)

Lead suggestion

The lead should certainly mention the absolutely remarkable population collapse from nearly 1 million people to some 300,000. This is extremely noteworthy but the lead seems to want to sell the city? Mattximus (talk) 23:23, 30 January 2022 (UTC)

A Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for speedy deletion

The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for speedy deletion:

You can see the reason for deletion at the file description page linked above. —Community Tech bot (talk) 01:06, 5 May 2022 (UTC)

Population

Why are the population estimates from 2021 posted within the Cleveland article itself, but not on the articles of other major cities? If San Jose isn't going to directly post their numbers bringing them under 1,000,000 residents, in addition to the countless other major cities that supposedly lost population from 2020-2021, why are we the only ones that do? I think it's best to leave the article posting the 2020 census information, if that's what other city articles reflect. 184.59.159.0 (talk) 02:52, 15 July 2022 (UTC)

Climate

The climate section needs work. It claims the Lake Erie shoreline is "nearly east-west" from the mouth of the Cuyahoga River to Sandusky. It claims that at the mouth of the Cuyahoga it "turns sharply northeast". It claims that this feature is the principle cause of the East Sides' lake effect snow. First, the latter is false! The "principle" cause is the sudden rise in elevation of the land, not the direction of the shoreline. (Although we can have a useless debate as to whether it is the land's rise, the prevailing wind direction, or the existence of the lake itself which is 'principle'.) Secondly, there's no sudden change of direction at the river's mouth. you can draw a line almost exactly Northeast at the lake shore from nearly the Western city limit East 30 miles to Fairport Harbor; there's no "sudden" change at the river outlet. See for yourself on any aerial photograph. Since the shoreline runs NE from (nearly) the Western boundary, it certainly shouldn't be described as running "nearly east-west" from the river to Sandusky. And neither should it be assumed that the reader understands that Sandusky is West of Cleveland (fact not mentioned) (nor Fairport Harbor East). The best I can come up with is to say the Southern shore of Lk Erie runs NE from Cleveland for 30 miles to Fairport Harbor.[if that fact is important enough to include? I'm not so sure...] East of the Cuyahoga River mouth, land elevation rises rapidly in the south which, together with the prevailing winds off the lake from the North West, is the principle reason for the East Side's Lake Effect Snow.174.130.71.156 (talk) 22:16, 11 January 2023 (UTC)

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