Talk:Classification of Arabic languages

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Untitled[edit]

I've splitted the page into Arabic languages and Ancient North Arabian. --Koryakov Yuri 12:06, 17 March 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Maltese[edit]

Maltese is not a third branch of this family. It descends from Siculo-Arabic, which is a dialect of Maghrebi Arabic, which is a variety of the Arabic macrolanguage. Yes, it's a separate language from Arabic, but mutual intelligibility and ethnic identity do not change its lineage.

Also, if we're not going to separate out Judeo-Arabic because it's already covered under 'varieties of Arabic', shouldn't we remove Standard Arabic as well? kwami (talk) 18:56, 14 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Regarding Maltese, yes, it is a third branch. I do not think you are understanding this. It is linguistically impossible for Maltese to simultaneously be classified under the Arabic language, yet not exist as a dialect of it at the same time. In linguistics, when a language is classified under another, it is a "dialect" (like American English under English, or Egyptian Arabic under Arabic).

French is descended from Latin. That doesn't make it a dialect of Latin. A third branch would make it a sister of Arabic rather than a daughter. kwami (talk) 19:14, 14 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I'll make a comparison. Latin is a language. Languages that came from Latin are now called Romance languages.

Arabic is a language. Languages that came from Arabic are now called Arabic languages. mɪn'dʒi:klə (talk) 19:15, 14 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

According to our usage, 'Arabic languages' is the superset, so it's not a close comparison. But either way, Maltese is an Arabic language. kwami (talk) 19:18, 14 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Please check my example of English and Norse on the Maltese discussion page. mɪn'dʒi:klə (talk) 19:20, 14 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Your English/Norse example is completely false. Maltese is a descendant of ARABIC, not of "Arabic languages" which includes Ancient North Arabic. (Taivo (talk) 19:55, 14 January 2009 (UTC))[reply]

Secondly, yes, either remove all the varieties covered by that page, or add all of them. We can't pick and choose which ones we feel like listing. mɪn'dʒi:klə (talk) 19:08, 14 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Of course we can. We have plenty of partial exemplar lists. kwami (talk) 19:14, 14 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Ancient North Arabian to be subsumed under Arabic Languages as a category[edit]

I removed this:

Old or Ancient North Arabian, a number of closely related extinct dialects of pre-Islamic Arabia:^[1]^[2]

on account of Ahmad al-Jallad's work. Wikipedia's movement on the classification of Arabian Semitica has been cautious - justifiably so, given the cranks out there. But I think we no longer need such caution. So my request to the editors of the Arabic project here is to delete "Ancient North Arabian" as a category, although the article itself is valuable and should stay. Instead this article on "Arabic languages" should take over that category's function. I'm also thinking it were better to rename this article to "ArabiAN languages". --Zimriel (talk) 22:15, 6 June 2015 (UTC)[reply]

References

^ Macdonald, M. C. A. (2000). "Reflections on the linguistic map of pre-Islamic Arabia". Arabian Archaeology and Epigraphy. Vol. 11. Retrieved 28 July 2014. {{cite conference}}: Unknown parameter |booktitle= ignored (|book-title= suggested) (help)
^ Macdonald, M. C. A. (2004). "Ancient North Arabian". In Woodard, Roger D. (ed.). The Cambridge Encyclopedia of the World's Languages. Cambridge University Press. pp. 488–533. ISBN 0-521-56256-2.

[1] Macdonald, M. C. A. (2000). "Reflections on the linguistic map of pre-Islamic Arabia". Arabian Archaeology and Epigraphy. Vol. 11. Retrieved 28 July 2014. {{cite conference}}: Unknown parameter |booktitle= ignored (|book-title= suggested) (help)

[2] Macdonald, M. C. A. (2004). "Ancient North Arabian". In Woodard, Roger D. (ed.). The Cambridge Encyclopedia of the World's Languages. Cambridge University Press. pp. 488–533. ISBN 0-521-56256-2.

[1]

[2]