Talk:Clan Armstrong

Copying from Wikipedia

I have added a Tag above to show that a private website is copying its history page directly from this Wikipedia article.QuintusPetillius (talk) 15:19, 27 July 2013 (UTC)

The Armstrong Curse

I cannot find the specific book at the moment, but I remember reading that the Armstrong clan had a curse put on it by the Queen of England some time during the 16th century.

As an Armstrong myself, I often wonder if this curse is true. Although I am not superstitious by any means. --KineticRic (talk) 06:20, 29 January 2009 (UTC)

I'm wondering if perhaps you're thinking of this curse, called "The Motion of Cursing" issued against the Armstrong Clan (and other clans) in 1525 by the Roman Catholic Archbishop of Glasgow? [1] Regards,MarmadukePercy (talk) 06:29, 29 January 2009 (UTC)

Motto

I think "vi et armis invictus maneo" would be more accurately translated "by strength and arms I remain unconquered" - it is a pun on the surname. I can't actually source this - maybe we could just translate it? Graemedavis (talk) 11:05, 23 February 2010 (UTC)

If you'll notice, on the List of Scottish clans, most of the mottos are given in Latin. And, yes, it is a pun on the surname. MarmadukePercy (talk) 11:22, 23 February 2010 (UTC)

As noted, the majority of early mottos are in Latin, but there is no pun intended. Literal transltions of Latin to English using modern internet engines will provide a number of translations. Invictus Maneo translates to "I remain unbeaten", yet within the context it is more properly "I Remain Unvanquished". Vi et arms invests maneo, directly translated becomes "By force of arms remain unbeaten", the 'I' is assumed as the speaker of the phrase. As with many languages, it is the context in which it is used that reveals the appropriate translation. "Vi et arms invictus maneo" would be "Through force of arms I remain unvanquished". ( I. Armstrong BA Ancient History & Languages ) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 58.178.234.127 (talk) 13:10, 12 October 2015 (UTC)

A quick note on this old conversation, just in case the topic every gets resurrected: "by force of arms remain unbeaten" isn't a direct translation of vi et armis invictus maneo, it is a mistranslation of it, and the "I" isn't assumed, it's right there explicitly in the verb maneo, which means "I remain" (or "I stay" or a few other, similar translations dependent on context). Latin did have first- and second-person nominative pronouns, but they were rarely used because the verb already conveyed who the subject was. (Speakers of certain modern languages, like Spanish, will be familiar with the idea.) And vi et armis definitely means "by force (or strength) and arms", not "of"; "by force of arms" would be vi armorum. "By strength and arms I remain unconquered" isn't the only literal translation of vi et armis invictus maneo, but it's just as literal as any of the other possible ones. Binabik80 (talk) 18:14, 21 September 2021 (UTC)

Notable Armstrong's?

I was wondering if anyone else thinks it would be appropriate to add a section on notable Armstrong's throughout history? --KineticRic (talk) 07:02, 5 July 2010 (UTC)

Think that unless an Armtrong is directly connected to clan business (e.g. chief) it is better to list notable at Armstrong (surname). Yours ever Czar Brodie (talk) 11:20, 7 July 2010 (UTC)

Yeah, I guess that makes sense. --KineticRic (talk) 18:02, 14 July 2010 (UTC)

sure that would be awesome (coming from one of the armstrong grandchilderen) 209.161.180.140 (talk) 23:00, 15 September 2022 (UTC)

Septs

You want me to find a medieval book to prove the Septs , well where are the medieval sources to back up that the Moffats and Elliots are notable clan allies of the Armstrongs? Also the Armstrongs ARE indirectly referred to in the Domesday Book. Fairbairn is the FOUNDING sept.--Tdforbust (talk) 02:32, 27 April 2011 (UTC)

Article re-write

This article is a complete mess and most of the information is unsourced. Any unsourced info can be removed from Wikipedia. I therefore intend to re-write the article with sources. Comments appreciated.QuintusPetillius (talk) 15:03, 18 October 2014 (UTC)

Doubtful - discuss: invented etymologies

Anyone who knows a little of or about Old Norse, Ango-Saxon or similar languages can see the absurdity of interpretations like these: "According to the legend and tradition, the first of the name Armstrong was Siward Beorn (sword warrior), who was also known as Siward Digry (sword strong arm)". For the record, Siward is a variant of Sigvard, Sigurðr etc., meaning "guardian of victory", Beorn means "bear" and "digry" (digri) means "the fat or big one". And an "i" that's later lost or is epenthetic after the "s" has no place in the etymology of the word "sword". But I won't go through the Internet for reliable sources that may not exist in such an esoteric subject and I'm not sure I possess a scholarly work stating such obvious things. If anyone else will or has, it's welcome. (In more articles than this, I suspect. Folk etymology is rife.) 151.177.62.155 (talk) 21:28, 8 November 2015 (UTC)

OK, a half concession about "beorn": refreshing my memory shows me that the word is problematic and had a meaning that is often translated as "warrior", for lack of more exact knowledge and perhaps modern term. 151.177.62.155 (talk) 21:51, 8 November 2015 (UTC)

Septs-Allies?

Crozier, and Nixon how classified? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 97.123.235.204 (talk) 01:06, 29 December 2015 (UTC)

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