Talk:Chair of the Federal Reserve/Archive 1

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Archive 1

Move

I propose Chairperson of the Federal Reserve.100110100 07:50, 1 April 2007 (UTC)

In order to send a message to the world that the U.S. is not prejudiced, the President should appoint an African-American woman to be Chairperson of the Federal Reserve in 2010.Lestrade (talk) 16:52, 5 April 2008 (UTC)Lestrade
Unless the government changes the name of this position, we can't just change it on here without sourcing. Also, the President should never appoint someone to a position 'just because' that person is black, as that would be reverse descrimination. It should be appointed to the most qualified person, so if that person happens to be black or a woman, then great. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Kman543210 (talk • contribs) 23:17, 9 April 2008 (UTC)

Supposed gender neutrality

Obviously a woman could hold the post, but that doesn't change whether or not the legal title is "Chairman" or "Chair". For example, even a female US Senator who chairs a committee is titled "Chairman". Also, Chairman is not a gendered term. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.147.171.226 (talk) 05:32, 27 October 2009 (UTC)

Chair vs. Chairman

This article was recently renamed from 'Chairman of the Federal Reserve' to 'Chair of the Federal Reserve'. The new title is incorrect. The position was created by the Federal Reserve Act which refers to the 'chairman of the Federal reserve bank '[1] - Crosbiesmith (talk) 15:52, 1 November 2009 (UTC)

powers

I would like to propose adding a description of the chairman's powers (i.e. adjusting interest rate, etc)

I am not very knowledgeable on the subject so someone please help. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.26.84.187 (talk) 13:37, 9 June 2010 (UTC)

Presidents' column in list messed up

It appears there is an issue with the column showing presidents in the list. My take is that the intention was to show each president and each fed chairman once, with horizontal lines of those two columns offset when the chairman changed during a presidential term. But, it isn't shown that way in every case. If the dates in the term column are correct, the term of Burns should be shown overlapping the term of Nixon; the term of Volker should be shown overlapping the term of Carter; the term of Greenspan should be shown overlapping the term of Carter; and the term of Bernanke should be shown overlapping the term of George W. Bush. There are probably other examples. To show as I think was intended is beyond my editing skills.

In additon, the link for reference 8 ("Fed Leadership and the 2000 Election". Financial Markets Center. February 26, 1999. Retrieved December 10, 2007) is broken. SlowJog (talk) 04:36, 16 September 2013 (UTC)

WP:NOTFORUM
The following discussion has been closed. Please do not modify it.

teh j00z

pls include info on jews controlling our money

jidf pls go — Preceding unsigned comment added by 173.175.198.33 (talk) 22:23, 27 January 2014 (UTC)

Requested move

The following discussion is an archived discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: page moved. Armbrust The Homunculus 16:10, 10 February 2014 (UTC)

Chairman of the Federal Reserve → Chair of the Federal Reserve – Requesting move because judging by past comments on this page, I suspect it may be controversial. Janet Yellen will become the new chair of the Federal Reserve on Feb. 3, 2014. Currently, she is referred to as the "Vice Chair" on the FRB website, as opposed to the old title "Vice Chairman" used for males. For note, news outlets use the term "chair" instead of "chairman" when referring to Yellen. Per WP:GNL and WP:TITLE, the name of the article should be changed to match the title used. See also gender marking in job titles. EvergreenFir (talk) 23:23, 2 February 2014 (UTC)

As of Monday, February 3, 2014, they are referring to Yellen as "Chair". See here. EvergreenFir (talk) 16:21, 3 February 2014 (UTC)
  • Support Move Yellen's bio at the Federal Reserve's website explicitly refers to her as "Chair". This list still lists her and her predecessors as "Chairmen", though that may well change. Alansohn (talk) 16:37, 3 February 2014 (UTC)
I almost changed that list but refrained from changing it until more discussion was done here with the rationale that any changes to the title would result in changes to the body of the article. EvergreenFir (talk) 16:48, 3 February 2014 (UTC)
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

History needs a little work

This page could benefit from some update to correct a minor misimpression. The Board of GOVERNORS of the Federal Reserve did not exist prior to the major reorganizaton of the Fed in 1935 (Banking Act of 1935). Prior to that time, the "Federal Reserve Board" (created in 1914 under the Federal Reserve Act of 1913) had a Board of DIRECTORS. Their salaries were significantly lower and their term of office were much shorter prior to 1935. (Essentially, the board folks in Washington were out-statused by the elite of the regional banks prior to 1935.)

Using the consumer price index (maybe not appropriately) the salaries are close to but less now than they were in 1913, in inflation adjusted dollars. [1] — Preceding unsigned comment added by 128.193.8.12 (talk) 05:02, 9 October 2013 (UTC)

Prior to 1935, the heads of the twleve district "Federal Reserve Banks" were called "Governors." In the 1935 act, the district heads had their titles changed to "President" (e.g., "President of the Federal Reserve Bank of St. Louis"), as part of a major shift of power to Washington.

Thus, Mariner Eccles was the first actual Chairman of the Board of Goernors of the Federal Reserve Board. The others prior to 1935 were Chairman of a Board of Directors of much more circumscribed power. FED using multiple policysy to regulate economy Great original sources are:

Beckhart, Benjamin Haggott. 1972. Federal Reserve System. [New York]: American Institute of Banking.
Meltzer, Allan H. 2003. A history of the Federal Reserve : Volume 1, 1913 -- 1951. Chicago :: University of Chicago Press.
Shull, Bernard. 2005. The fourth branch : the Federal Reserve's unlikely rise to power and influence. Westport, Conn.: Praeger.

I do not have time today to update the article and wikify the sources. N2e 13:04, 11 May 2006 (UTC)

This is now fixed. I updated the article and added references on 30 May, and also today made a cleanup correction for something that went amuck on a previous fix of some vandalism. N2e 16:51, 29 June 2006 (UTC)
Some of the commentary above is wrong. The change from "Federal Reserve Board" to "Board of Governors of the Federal Reserve System" was a NAME CHANGE. So, yes, the Board of Governors did exist prior to the 1935 Act. It was called the "Federal Reserve Board." A name change, folks.
And, no, prior to 1935, the Federal Reserve Board did not have its own "Board of Directors." A "board of directors" for the Board? That's nonsensical gibberish.
However, each Federal Reserve bank had a board of directors.
Obviously, I have not been watching this article -- or this talk page -- closely enough. Famspear (talk) 03:22, 26 July 2016 (UTC)

PS: Here is the actual verbatim wording of subsection (a) of section 203 of the Banking Act of 1935 (from page 704 of volume 49 of the United States Statutes at Large):

SEC. 203. (a) Hereafter the Federal Reserve Board shall be known as the "Board of Governors of the Federal Reserve System", and the governor and the vice governor of the Federal Reserve Board shall be known as the "chairman" and the "vice chairman", respectively, of the Board of Governors of the Federal Reserve System.

--from Sec. 203, Banking Act of 1935, Pub. L. No. 305, 49 Stat. 684, 704 (Aug. 23, 1935). Famspear (talk) 03:28, 26 July 2016 (UTC)

Note: Until a few minutes ago, the article also contained a statement to the effect that once appointed, the Governors "may not be removed from office for their policy opinions". While that may or may not be a correct statement of what the law is, the material that was cited to support that statement did not support that statement. What the statute actually indicates is that the President may remove a member of the Board of Governors -- in the precise words of the statute -- "for cause". The phrase "for cause" is not defined in the statute.

Again, as Wikipedia editors, let's not make up our own interpretations of what the phrase "for cause" means in that statute. Famspear (talk) 03:38, 26 July 2016 (UTC)

References

  1. ^ http://federalreserve.gov/faqs/about_12591.htm

Supposed racial neutrality

Obviously a gentile could theoretically hold the post, but that doesn't change weather or not one would ever be permitted to do so without risking the way it is currently run. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 64.129.184.107 (talk) 17:37, 9 October 2013 (UTC)

It ends in "man"--it is indeed a gendered word. Inclusivity is never a bad thing. Dash1224 (talk) 07:46, 3 April 2013 (UTC)

Several gentiles have held the post. The most recent was Volker, a protestant. (The article on him says "As a child, he attended his mother's Lutheran church, while his father went to an Episcopal church.") The one most notable for his religion was arguably Marriner S. Eccles, a Morman who attended Brigham Young College and served as a Latter-day Saint missionary in Scotland.47.139.44.241 (talk) 01:48, 26 March 2017 (UTC)

Chairmen pro tem

Could someone who knows about this subject explain why two of those who have held the post have only been Chairman of the Federal Reserve pro tem? One appears to have held the office on a temporary basis when his term expired and pending the appointment of a successor, but in the case of Alan Greenspan, his period of temporary appointment occurs in the middle of a long appointment. His own biography doesn't appear to explain why. Sam Blacketer (talk) 23:52, 9 June 2009 (UTC)

Regular appointments to certain federal positions require Senate confirmation, but if there is a vacancy when the Senate is not in session, the President can make a "recess appointment" without Senate confirmation. If his original term expired and the President decided to appoint him to a second term, but the Senate did not confirm him in time, then he might have been appointed pro tem while awaiting Senate confirmation. I have no idea if that is what happened, but it would make sense.47.139.44.241 (talk) 01:55, 26 March 2017 (UTC)

Outdated

Obama is no longer incumbent. Trump is now the President, and as such should be added. Please update. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 62.84.71.162 (talk) 11:24, 10 August 2017 (UTC)

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Is "Chair" actually gender neutral?

I say not out of any personal view of the genderedness (or lack thereof) of the word "Chairman", but because of the Fed's usage. When the page was moved it was noted was Yellen was already styled "Vice-Chair". But interestingly, while she has, as expected, been known as the "Chair", Stanley Fischer, is noted as being the "Vice-Chairman" on the Fed website. There is a list of the of the "Chairmen" on the website, inclusive of Yellen. This would suggest she is one of the Chairmen of the Federal Reserve and that that is the title of the office. Thus there is divergence between Yellen's title- which is clearly Chair- and that of the office, which would appear to be Chairman. This implies that Chair is actually the female gendered counterpart of the ungendered Chairman insofar as the Federal Reserve is concerned; it is therefore disingenuous to title the page "Chair of the Federal Reserve". Unless the title of the office changes with the gender of the occupant much like that of the King/Queen of the United Kingdom, which could be the case, but it would still mean that the neutral term is Chairmen. At the very least, it would mean that there should be a list of the "Chairmen of the Federal Reserve" rather than a list of "Chairs" (which would be tantamount to having a list of Chairwomen) or that Ben Bernanke was the "Chairman" of the Federal Reserve, not the "Chairperson" as his article presently styles him, much less the "Chair".

Interestingly, enough, Yellen's page on the Fed website notes that she "also serves as Chairman of the Federal Open Market Committee, the System's principal monetary policymaking body." (emphasis added)

I'm not a linguist, however, so I recognise I'm wading into dangerous waters here. Just some thoughts. --Simfan34 (talk) 20:19, 16 July 2014 (UTC)

Chair is an abbreviation first, and gender-neutral only as a side effect. Alan Greenspan was the 'Fed Chair' in colloquial shorthand. So is Yellen. The formal name of the office is probably governed by statute, and I'm sure there are plenty of laws still on the books which use the formal title of Chairman of the blah blah. But that too is an abbreviation in some sense; in traditional grammar, the use of 'man' is construed as implying 'a human / humanity / all humans' depending on context. So there is some grammatical tension in the idea of calling this article Chair of the Federal Reserve, when the formal title is likely different in some places, but article titles are supposed to reflect what the bulk of the sources say, with an eye to avoid confusing the readership. WP:COMMONNAME and WP:Readers_first, especially the bit about "presented in a way that is difficult for the reader to understand, or in a style the reader does not like" which is applicable to our discussion. Therefore, it makes sense to title the article fed-chair, or the slightly more formal chair-of-the-fed, or the significantly more formal chair-of-the-federal-reserve (current practice), but it would be needlessly confusing to title it chairman-of-the-federal-reserve (maximum formality which goes against common sense post-2014 and goes against colloquial usage since at least the 1980s and probably since the 1960s or 1970s). I don't have access to what the colloquial term was in the 1940s and 1930s, but this article hints that it might have been 'director of the board of governors' rather than the more modern 'chair[hu][man] of the fed'. In any case, it won't be necessary to change the article-title BACK in 2018, should Yellen be replaced after her current term expires, because 'chair' applies to anybody (both grammatically as an abbreviation and in terms of gender by removing the abbreviated -[hu]man portion of the suffix). Yellen is the chair of the FOMC, and also the chair[hu]man of the FOMC, simultaneously, but it is probably most common to speak of her as being the chair, or in formal situations she might be referred to as 'madam chair' methinks (I've seen that phrasing used in municipal politics), or even the somewhat archaic 'madam chairwoman' possibly. Be that as it may, wikipedia currently has the correct article title, chair of the federal reserve, where we abbreviate and simultaneously further-gender-neutralize the first word but we keep the more-formal federal reserve rather than shortening the title to Fed Chair (which is a redirect here). Give it a couple decades, and see how the language has evolved by then, and whether the position still exists in recognizable form. Oh, and I've carefully avoided mentioning the question about whether to say list-of-chairmen-of-the-fed, or list-of-chairs-of-the-fed, because thanks to the weird grammatical pluralization of man/men woman/women it sounds WRONG to say list-of-chairs-of-the-fed ... methinks because internally our grammatical brains understand that phrase to be a shorthand for list-of-chair[hu][man]s-of-the-fed. The way to avoid some of the awkwardness is to instead say list-of-fed-chairs, which rolls off the tongue quite nicely, or slighly more formally, list-of-federal-reserve-chairs, which does NOT roll off the tongue as easily. I have gone ahead and changed the name of the relevant subsection in this article, from Chair_of_the_Federal_Reserve#Chairs_of_the_Federal_Reserve that was previously used, to Chair_of_the_Federal_Reserve#List_of_Fed_Chairs, plus tweaked the opening sentence thereof. There are other places where the chairs-of-the-federal-reserve language is still in place, such as the category by that name, but I will leave it to others to try and figure out how to achieve wiki-wide consistency. 47.222.203.135 (talk) 09:28, 7 December 2016 (UTC)
I know this is several years after the fact... but my understanding is that it shouldn't matter to Wikipedia editors whether something is or isn't gender-neutral or sexist or any other label... as least when it comes to editing pages on Wikipedia. If it's the word in general usage, than thats what should be on the page. We're not supposed to be trying to influence anything or even determine "politically correct usage" in any direction, but simply reflecting the reality at that time. If the term "Chairman" is used, so be it. If the term "Biological Male with a penis and testicles who is in charge" is the title, so be it. I should have thought that was obvious.

Bzzzing (talk) 21:30, 7 May 2018 (UTC)

Pre-1935 Section

I was wondering if there should be a section in the article about how the Chair of the Federal Reserve was before the Banking Act of 1935. It is mentioned in the chart that the McAdoo served both as Fed Chair and Treasury Secretary and an explanation as to how the position transitioned from this to being separately appointed could be of interest to discuss. - Karthanitesh (talk) 04:10, 18 January 2022 (UTC)

Can the Chairman of the Fed be fired by the President?

At the bottom of the third paragraph a very black and white pronouncement is made in the article: "The chairs cannot be dismissed by the president before the end of their term."

But is this true? The provided reference goes to an article that makes that claim, but it is still an opinion of the author, and one which there is a lot of disagreement from equally qualified people.

We could say for sure that "no fed chair has ever been fired by the POTUS" and then say that the legality of doing so is disputed, and would likely have to be resolved in the courts.

Here, for instance is an article from PBS on this topic from a few years ago:

Does the President Have the legal Authority to Fire The Fed Chair

The article is in the form of a discussion between two experts:

The law says that the president can remove a member of the Federal Reserve's Board of Governors, which includes Jay Powell — quote — "for cause." And most legal scholars thinks that means the president can't do it just because he doesn't agree with the Fed chairman about policy. He needs to have some grounds beyond that.

So the law doesn't say anything about it, and opinion is more divided. There are some people who think the president has considerable latitude to do that, basically, for any reason that he would like.

There are some people who think that there is a similar amount of protection, that the president would need to find some cause beyond a policy disagreement even to remove Mr. Powell as chairman. That is a much more open question.

The authors of this other article (Title also phrased as question) come up with a similar answer: Yes, probably, but only for cause. And the case would likely be tested in court. This is from the financial press and authorship is attributed to "FXCM Research Team"

Can the US President Fire the Fed Chair?

The Fed itself is fairly clear on the matter of whether the president can actually fire the Fed chief. According to Section 10, Paragraph 2 of the Federal Reserve Act, members of the Fed's Board of Governors—including the chair—are nominated by the president to 14-year terms and cannot be removed before then except "for cause."[1]

I note that the actual text of the Federal Reserve Act is pretty unambiguous that the Chair *may be* fired, but only for cause.

There are many other articles on this topic. None make the sort of powerful blanket statement that this Wikipedia article does. I believe that this prohibition is not absolute, and this article should be updated to put in a more nuanced explanation, similar to those I have cited here, and many others which are easily discoverable. ZeroXero (talk) 20:11, 21 September 2022 (UTC)

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