Talk:Agony in the Garden

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Which bible?[edit]

It would be nice to know which translation the quotes from the bible are from. Jaddle 15:13, 22 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Original Research[edit]

Removed interpretation of biblical language, as it did not cite sources and did not appear to follow Wikipedia standards. Appeared to be someones own thoughts on the subject matter.Davepetr (talk) 08:41, 9 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I do not know what you removed but I hope it was not the removal of the interpretation of agon as dicussion/disputation, with the divine in this case, for that is what the word means.

I have added the relevant point but have not referenced due to lack of rachnical nous. http://wapedia.mobi/en/Passion_%28Christianity%29 cites the translation.

It is cold fact that this is where the terms from - we derive our meaning of agony from the greek meaning agon (contest/struggle/debate/discussion) from this one discussion, so important in western thought, and so poignant in content, that it has come to denote almost exclusively an emotion rather than an action. This is fascinating regardless of one's convictions and faith, and evidences the depth with which the christian legacy has permeated and shaped our very language. (Consider also passion in this regard - it comes from the root paschio - i suffer - and the profundity of the tale has layered depth upon depth to the meaning of the word, which perhaps took on new connotations along with the older ones in the Romantic tradition.) If noone else can do a better job on tracking down these references, let me know. It's not my area as such, I'm doing I.T. at the mo, but I am interested in philology. I am also in a university with a large theology department and the library has an overwhelmingly immense theology section, predominantly Catholic (compared to other sections such as philosophy it really is extraordinrarily large. Huge. I mean it, it's massive, anyway..).. So I should be able to track down a few good references if I have to. Anyway. If someone would like to let me know, remind me here or over at the Classics page where I'm asking about the manner by which the classical canon came down to us. Thanks. Otherwise, leave the text as is until we can get a better reference. The one above should serve as stopgap. Thanks

Also, cf http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/agony "[Middle English agonie, from Old French, from Late Latin agōnia, from Greek agōniā, from agōn, struggle, from agein, to drive; see ag- in Indo-European roots.]"

The issue actually seems a little complicated from browsing the full LSJ dictionary there may be the occasional use of the word in the psychological sense earlier than Christ. What is really needed is scholarly article on the subject of which I am sure there are several. It is very difficult to give a view from these sources without it amounting to some amount of interpretation and therefore one's own scholarly work. Nevertheless, we shoudl leave some mention until a proper reference can be found.

—Preceding unsigned comment added by 79.97.217.134 (talk) 22:54, 26 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]