Talk:AJ Lee/GA1

GA Review

Article (edit | visual edit | history) · Article talk (edit | history) · Watch

Reviewer: Lee Vilenski (talk · contribs) 10:15, 12 April 2018 (UTC)

Hello, I am planning on reviewing this article for GA Status, over the next couple of days. Thank you for nominating the article for GA status. I hope I will learn some new information, and that my feedback is helpful.

If nominators or editors could refrain from updating the particular section that I am updating until it is complete, I would appreciate it to remove a edit conflict. Please address concerns in the section that has been completed above (If I've raised concerns up to references, feel free to comment on things like the lede.)

I generally provide an overview of things I read through the article on a first glance. Then do a thorough sweep of the article after the feedback is addressed. After this, I will present the pass/failure. I will use strikethrough tags when concerns are met. Even if something is obvious why my concern is met, please leave a message as courtesy.

Best of luck! you can also use the {{done}} tag to state when something is addressed. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 11:18, 21 February 2018 (UTC)

Immediate Failures

• It is a long way from meeting any one of the six good article criteria - Article is of significant length for a GA review
• It contains copyright infringements - Pictures are all from Commons. CopyVio check brings up no issues
• It has, or needs, cleanup banners that are unquestionably still valid. These include {{cleanup}}, {{POV}}, {{unreferenced}} or large numbers of {{citation needed}}, {{clarify}}, or similar tags. (See also {{QF-tags}}). - No tags in the article
• It is not stable due to edit warring on the page. - Not overall ridiculous amount of edits to the page.

Links

• No Disambiguation pages (Other than AJ (Wrestler) on page.
• All references are labelled as "good". Links are well achived as well, good job!

Prose

Lede

• May not be my place to say, but is this article the best place for AJ (wrestler) to redirect too? Is A.J Styles not more of the WP:COMMONNAME?
  • They shortened her actual ring name to "AJ" for a while, which is why it redirects here. It could be made into a dab page though. Prefall 12:31, 12 April 2018 (UTC)
    • Probably a disambiguation. I'd add a bit to either AJ, or AJ (given name), and add both members. Then redirect AJ (wrestler) to whichever is more suitable.
• "...is an American author and retired professional wrestler. She is best known for her time in WWE under the ring name AJ Lee." - Should it not read American professional wrestler and author? She is much more well known for her in-ring work than her writing. Also, the WWE should be written as World Wrestling Entertainment, with WWE in bracket after.
  • She is an active author, and has retired from professional wrestling. I believe this is the common layout in this scenario. Prefall 12:31, 12 April 2018 (UTC)
    • It is? I would have thought it would work like WP:COMMONNAME, where it's what the person was most well known for. I had a look at WP:LEDE, but couldn't find a definition through Skimming.
• Overall Lede is very good well done
• Infobox needs some more sourcing. The article claims she was trained by Jay Lethal, and has sourcing elsewhere in the article, but this should also be in the infobox.
  • Citations are not needed in the lead or infobox for things that are cited in the body of the article, per WP:LEADCITE. Jay Lethal being her trainer does not seem like a controversial claim that warrants the overcite. Prefall 12:31, 12 April 2018 (UTC)

Early Life

• "As an homage to her brother, who was in the U.S. Army, she once wore camouflage wrestling attire" - This should mention where she wore this. Was this a WWE event, or indy?
  • She wore camouflage on the independent circuit, as well as her time in Florida Championship Wrestling. None of the sources make this distinction so it is left vague intentionally. Prefall 12:31, 12 April 2018 (UTC)
    • That's ok then. I'd be happier if we could find a link, but I appreicate it may not exist. She certainly didn't do this in the WWE, as far as I can remember.
• "Mendez was diagnosed with bipolar disorder in her early twenties,[17] a condition that her mother also suffered from." - Wording
  •  Done Prefall 12:31, 12 April 2018 (UTC)
• "She had previously experienced adverse effects from a misdiagnosis of depression and overdosed on antidepressants and painkillers" - Overlinking. I'm all for lots of wikilinks, but 4 wikilinks in eight words is too many. Remove one or two.
  •  Done I've unlinked the general terms antidepressants and painkillers. Prefall 12:31, 12 April 2018 (UTC)
• "This event, which she considers a suicide attempt, caused her to seek proper treatment and the right diagnosis.[19] She credits the condition for giving her the bravery to achieve her goals.[10]" - I feel this needs expansion, probably mention that it was in her book that she mentions this.
  • It was revealed in her book, but she has talked about it in various media since, such as podcasts, interviews and keynotes. The citations for it is from a print interview where she discusses it. Prefall 12:31, 12 April 2018 (UTC)

Pro Wrestling Career

• "She also won the annual WSU/NWS King and Queen of the Ring tournament alongside Jay Lethal two months later." - The linked article is only for WSU. What was NWS?
  •  Done National Wrestling Superstars, who were co-promoting the event with WSU. Prefall 12:31, 12 April 2018 (UTC)
• Can you mention that after AJ was signed, the tag team titles she'd won was defended in her stead?
  • That does not seem notable to AJ herself, as she was no longer involved. Prefall 12:31, 12 April 2018 (UTC)
    • Makes sense. Although it's kinda weird that it says she relenquished them, when in actuality, she had a substitute.
• "Mendez signed a contract with WWE in May 2009, after she took part in a tryout camp that she paid US$1,500 to attend.[22]" - Swap this sentence around Mention that she took part in the tryout, and would later be signed.
  •  Done Prefall 12:31, 12 April 2018 (UTC)
• "she engaged in a feud with the winner, Naomi Knight, and her character became a heel ("bad guy")." - You've already linked heel, so you don't need to put what it means in brackets. If you would like to stay away from kayfabe, you could say "her character became villainous, with AJ turning heel." or similar.
  • Per WP:PW/SG, heel and face were considered WP:JARGON terms and thus need to be explained in parenthesis on their first mention. I would use non-jargon terms instead, but the "face" alternatives are "fan favorite" and "hero" which I'm not fond of. The former can be misleading (just because you're a face doesn't mean the fans cheer or like you), and the latter just comes off aggressive in wrestling context. Prefall 12:31, 12 April 2018 (UTC)
    • I must admit I'm not a big fan of having to explain jargon, when we can wikilink things like this, but ok.
• "In February 2010, AJ defeated Serena Mancini to win the Queen of FCW title... In November, AJ lost the Queen of FCW title to Rosa Mendes" expansion. Two sentences simply saying she won the title, then lost it. Should probably mention how she won her first WWE owned title or something.
  • There really isn't much information readily available from the FCW promotion besides pure match results, so I'm not sure how much more I can add. Prefall 12:31, 12 April 2018 (UTC)
• "Beginning in September 2010, AJ took part in the third season of NXT, a show that blended into a reality competition format" - it should be noted that it was a professional wrestling and reality show hybrid, rather than a reality competition.
  •  Done Prefall 12:31, 12 April 2018 (UTC)
• "Primo was assigned as her mentor in the storyline.[31]" - Not so much a storyline, as it was part competition. Should probably read that he was her "pro", and explination.
  • I used "mentor" as a substitute for "pro". Their pairings were part of the professional wrestling storyline portion of the show. Just for drama. Prefall 12:31, 12 April 2018 (UTC)
    • This could be expanded, as that role was known as their "pro" on the show.
• "Along with their mentor Natalya,[40] they feuded with the trio of Alicia Fox, Tamina and Rosa Mendes for two months, trading wins and losses" - Unimportant that they traded losses. Should only be mentioned if one side was particularly better.
  •  Done Removed. Prefall 12:31, 12 April 2018 (UTC)
• "On January 13, 2012, while accompanying Bryan for his title defense, she was accidentally crashed into by Big Show and carried off on a stretcher as part of the storyline" - Crashed into? Was he driving a car?
  •  Done I changed it to "struck". Let me know if you have a better suggestion. Prefall 12:31, 12 April 2018 (UTC)
    • Struck is MUCH better :).
• "On August 27 and September 24, she was involved in separate altercations with Vickie Guerrero and Paul Heyman, in which she assaulted them." The word assault is quite a strong word. Probably attacked is a better word.
  •  Done I was just looking for a little variation there. Prefall 12:31, 12 April 2018 (UTC)
• "she explained that Cena had toyed with her emotions and broke her heart, so she helped Ziggler break him" - This probably needs quotations.
  •  Done Prefall 12:31, 12 April 2018 (UTC)
• "While she continued to mock Kaitlyn,[103][104] they participated in the first in-ring contract signing for a Divas Championship bout" - This was their second match, but their first contract signing? That's confusing.
  •  Done Changed to "first ever". That was the first contract signing in the Divas Championship's six-year history up to that point. Prefall 12:31, 12 April 2018 (UTC)
• "Angered by her unwanted action, Ziggler ended their relationship. She exacted revenge by costing him another match, then attacked him alongside Langston.[108] On August 2, Langston was banned from attending her matches. However, AJ again retained the title from Kaitlyn, who was betrayed by Layla.[109] Kaitlyn and Ziggler ultimately joined together to defeat AJ and Langston in a mixed tag team match at SummerSlam on August 18.[110]" - Probably harder to explain, but she jumps Langston, and then tags with him?
  •  Done No, she and Langston attacked Ziggler together. I changed "alongside" to "with"; hopefully that makes it clear. Prefall 12:31, 12 April 2018 (UTC)
    • That does make more sense. It was ambiguous at best before.
• "The next night on Raw, AJ challenged the debuting Paige to an impromptu title match and was defeated, ending her then-record reign at 295 days.[127][d] Mendez was subsequently granted time off.[128]" - Mention why she needed/wanted time off.
  • This is not covered by any sources. She did not mention this in her book either. In my personal opinion, she had just gotten engaged and wanted to spend time to plan her wedding. Prefall 12:31, 12 April 2018 (UTC)
    • I believe that's a good point, and I believe she may have tweeted about it at the time, but I couldn't find a source for you either. Maybe a change to make it known that she wanted and was granted time off, it's a short sentence for a hiatus.
• "They started pretending to be best friends in a facetious manner." should probably wikilink facetious
  •  Done Prefall 12:31, 12 April 2018 (UTC)
• "AJ returned on the March 2 episode of Raw, saving her former rival Paige, who was being attacked by Nikki and Brie Bella.[145] AJ and Paige allied together to defeat the Bella Twins at WrestleMania 31 on March 29.[146] Five days later on April 3, WWE announced that Mendez decided to retire from in-ring competition.[147][148]" - You could mention that her final match was this match at Mania.
  • She had another match the next night on Raw in a random six-woman tag, so the WrestleMania match was not her final one. I do not cover that event because it was a routine, non notable match that did not acknowledge her impending retirement. Simply being the final match did not seem significant enough given the circumstances. Prefall 12:31, 12 April 2018 (UTC)
    • She did? I remember her match at WrestleMania not being very good, but I didn't remember her coming back for RAW. Maybe it should simply be mentioned that was her last match, as despite it being routine, no ones last match is unimportant.

Notes & References

• Notes and references are well packaged. well done.

Other issues

• Pictures really need alt-text.
• Her book is currently down as "Sources", should this not be "further reading"?
  • I originally had it as "Further reading" but thought its inclusion as a source in certain points of the article would be better understood with the "Source" heading. Prefall 12:31, 12 April 2018 (UTC)
    • It's probably ok, as it was mentioned several times in the article.

Overall, a good article, but quite a few nitpicking things above need addressing before I'll finish the review. Now placed on hold.

• @Lee Vilenski: I've answered all of your points and applied immediate changes where I could. Thank you for reviewing this. I've been waiting for almost a year! Haha. Prefall 12:31, 12 April 2018 (UTC)
• @Prefall: - Thanks for getting back so quickly. There's a few things left that I'd still like a little bit of clarification, but I feel it's more than likely a GA article. If you could indulge me for a little bit longer, and clear these things up. I've made these things bold.

Also, thank you so much for your willingness to improve the article from someone with significantly less experience. I feel pretty embarrassed that this article has taken such a long time for a GA review. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 13:46, 12 April 2018 (UTC)

I've addressed your final three points of "WWE Pro" acknowledgement, her final match and redirected AJ (wrestler) to AJ (given name)#In sport (not sure if it's necessary to start a brand new dab page for just two names—hopefully an alright compromise). The structure of the occupations seems like a judgement call.

It's very common to go a long while without a review on professional wrestling articles, as a lot of people are not interested in the business and it can be difficult to understand for a newcomer. You've got way more courage than me since I haven't yet trusted myself to review any sort of article. Thank you, again. Prefall 14:13, 12 April 2018 (UTC)

It's a bit sad really, as we should really be able to review any article; regardless of subject matter. Unless someone has a real distain for Pro Wrestling, it should be fine. I don't mind being the PW GA review guy, but I'll want to nominate a few of my own soon! This is my sixth review (I think), so hopefully I'm getting the hang of it, and I don't suck! I think this article is easily good enough for WP:GA, so I'll upgrade it now. Thank you for your patience, and being so responsive. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 14:29, 12 April 2018 (UTC)

GA Review

GA review (see here for what the criteria are, and here for what they are not)

1. It is reasonably well written.

   a (prose, spelling, and grammar): b (MoS for lead, layout, word choice, fiction, and lists):

   On Hold. Tightening of structure as above

2. It is factually accurate and verifiable.

   a (reference section): b (citations to reliable sources): c (OR): d (copyvio and plagiarism):

   Well sourced!

3. It is broad in its coverage.

   a (major aspects): b (focused):

   Article covers all parts of AJ's life

4. It follows the neutral point of view policy.

   Fair representation without bias:

   Well sourced, once again. Article is WP:NPOV

5. It is stable.

   No edit wars, etc.:

6. It is illustrated by images and other media, where possible and appropriate.

   a (images are tagged and non-free content have fair use rationales): b (appropriate use with suitable captions):

7. Overall:

   Pass/Fail: